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A healthcare worker’s take on Dungeon Meshi shipping discourse

Hiya y’all! As someone who has become a fan of Dungeon Meshi (honestly one of my favorite franchises at this moment) I’d just like to give more of a nuanced take on a shipping discourse I’ve seen. I’d like to clarify this with I am an NA. I’ve literally been recognized by the country I live in through the sunshine awards system on my contributions to my patients lives. All this to say, I know a bit about healthcare. And I also think that. Personally, people should be allowed to ship whatever they please. They shouldn’t be made to feel guilty for what they enjoy, especially if it isn’t hurting anyone.

I’d like to clarify what I am speaking on, this being the controversy surrounding the ships Mithrun and Kabru, vs Laios and Kabru. Both of which are valid ships in my opinion! I think both are great! And whichever you like you should feel comfortable and happy to indulge in it.

I work mostly with geriatric and bariatric patients, as I work on a cardiac unit. So, by proxy, I witness a lot of disabled people come through. This to say that these people HAVE partners. And their partners care for them. Such as feeding their partners if they need help eating, helping their partners feel safe if they have dementia, I have even seen someone clean their spouse after they had soiled themself. All of which are examples of love and affection, as partners. Not as a provider doing their job.

The argument i see many a time against the ship of Mithrun and Kabru, is that it is unethical. As Kabru would be a “provider” in this case, and Mithrun would be a “patient” to this I say, is Kabru being paid in this hypothetical? Is he following training he has been given? Is he following a code of ethics given to healthcare workers when he helps Mithrun with his disability? Disabled people deserve love. And they deserve a partner that cares for them. So the argument that the ship is gross is kind of… weird. Isn’t it? Again. Mithrun and Kabru as partners do not have to be your cup of tea, but that doesn’t mean that anyone who DOES ship them is gross or immoral. Helping your partner because they are disabled is an act of love, and completely different from a provider helping their patient.

Statistically, everyone will either die able bodied or live to become disabled. It happens to everyone. Disabilities are almost as much of a fact of life as breathing is. I am new to the Dungeon Meshi fandom, but the insinuation that someone able bodied cannot have a disabled partner is kind of horrible to actual able bodied/disabled partnerships? The dynamic is so common, and so to say that it is gross, almost implies that the dynamic in a day to day is gross.

This post isn’t meant to be inflammatory, there are so many dungeon meshi ships I love with all my heart. Some that are rare pairs, some that are common within the fandom. I just think that people should be more friendly with each other. Kabru has two hands guys it’s okay /j /lh. Just please be more friendly guys. Both ships are valid. But the way the fandom gets so angry over it makes me scared. And I imagine it makes other people who are new to the manga/anime a little scared too.

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mithrun makes me insane in many senses but one that's particularly depressing to me is how he is stripped of his agency, not only in the narrative, but by the audience as well. he shows time and time again how strong, capable, and independent he can be with just a little support from others, and yet his family, the canaries, and the fandom treat him as if he can't even chew food by himself. on one hand, it's impressive work by kui, she can tell which biases surround her characters and she weaves them into the narrative to have us think more deeply about them; on the other hand its sad that it kinda flies over people's heads and people fall exactly into the very same things she criticises. Though it honestly makes it even more powerful when characters go against all that to truly, deeply respect him and his independence, and I also love seeing how Mithrun interacts with the other dungeon lords with the compassion he was never given in his situation--

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i get it, i myself not a big fan of big age differences in relationships (personal preference), but you have to admit that kabru would be into older people. i mean, analyzing people is his special interest and in general older people are just naturally more interesting because they have more life experience. he'd be "a nice young man" who sits and talks to all those old ladies in the park for hours. holding their hands gently while he listens to all fucked up bullshit they had to go through. you can't convince me he cares about age difference

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Saw someone describe Mithrun as a "Disabled right wing veteran who is convinced hes just as capable as he was in his prime" and also that he would "complain about immigrants" and I'm very confused.

Where did this type of interpretation for Mithrun came from? There's nothing about him that indicates he's "right wing" or any more racist than the average elf and due to his condition he literally isn't able to care about that.

The sentiment of "Mithrun is a racist grandpa" seems to have gone from an absurdist joke based on him saying a "slur" into a real interpretation of the character??

First of all he's 37 in tallman years he is not a grandpa, I know it was a joke based on him being rough and the fact he's an elf (185 years old) but I'm starting to think some people really think he's grandpa age? He isn't, he's about as old as Senshi and Chilchuck, Senshi is actually older than him being 47 in tallman years if he's a grandpa they are too, it's going from funny way to call him into ableist territory pretty fast.

Second he doesn't have the ability to be racist anymore, racism implies a sense of superiority compared to someone else from another race, which all the elves have. Let's go thru his anime appearance and what happens.

Kabru shows up and tries to speak to the elves and convince them to try his way. The elves think the short lived people are all ignorant and treat them condescendingly, even Tansu because they live more than any other race

Then they go from "Short lived people are too stupid to know anything" into "Oh my god this poor baby come on have some cake :)" which is ALSO condescending, nobody is taking Kabru or the governor seriously because they're short lived. These elves are RACIST they're treating Kabru like he's a confused kid "come eat some cake and let the adults talk"

Mithrun is the only authority figure that wants to listen to Kabru

He is a shell of who he used to be, right now he ONLY cares about defeating the demon, if there is a chance this kid (who has had experience with dungeons before) knows another way to get him what he wants he will listen to it, cause he *doesn't* have the capability of being like the other elves.

This doesn't mean he's anti-racist, it means he literally doesn't care, he lets the other elves mistreat Kabru in every other scene unless it has something to do with defeating the dungeon, cause he *doesn't* care. He's not gonna complain about immigrants cause he doesn't care he's not gonna treat short lived people like kids cause he doesn't care, he cannot care, he lost the ability to care.

Past Mithrun was the one that was both racist classicist and a bitch, but that part of him is basically dead.

He said the slur because they asked him not because he thinks is appropriate, the other elves aren't casual racists and him the *real* racist they are all just as bad he just doesn't have the "desire to be socially acceptable" I guess, they asked, he answered and that was it.

If it would make it easier try to think about it in terms of real life bigotry and how people keep going "you can't even say (...) because of the woke" they aren't any less racist they just worry about being socially acceptable racists.

Anyway, please don't just repeat what other people say as jokes as if they're true especially when you're saying it about a disabled character. Acting like he's worse than his peers because he doesn't have the capability of being socially aware is ableism, calling him a grandpa because he has had a rough life that made him look disheveled is ableism, saying he's past his prime is also ableist considering he learned how to fight *after* he became disabled.

Correct me if anything I said was wrong but I really got peeved after reading several people misinterpreting Mithrun as some sort of bigoted old man who must be taken to an asylum as if he just causes trouble for people who care for him.

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The character of the Trunchbull really is an indictment of 20th century LGBT rights in Britain when you think about it. She should have owned a downtown gay bar called The Iron Maiden and spent her time annihilating willowy femmes in her tastefully appointed upstairs apartment. But instead she taught schoolchildren. Alas.

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screenshot redraw 😭

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he used to be so hated in 2018-2019 and i was hoping it would all die down once the anime came out but until now im still seeing violent comments about him that i dont even see other characters get, not even toshiro lol

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They literally would like kabru is all for humanity and mithrun has dedicated his time in melini to destroying remnants of the demon. He’d be coming after laios like he did with marcille that one time but with none of the suicidal tendencies 😭

I think in that demon Laios au if Farcille are on his side Kabumisu would be that one couple that gets married to show that not all hope is lost or whatever that trope means you know like Finnick and Annie in Mockingjay

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I think it’s awesome how labru shippers will tell you shipping kabumisu is ableist and racist bc kabru shows his soft caring side to mithrun and you’re “turning a brown character into a nanny” (yea don’t ask yourself how disabled ppl who have partners who are also caregivers think about this framing) and then in the next breath will call mithrun a dog, a thing, can’t we just kill it already? isn’t it great how the fandom has decided it’s totally normal to call a canon disabled rape victim that? I think that’s so cool

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In your Mithrun analysis, when you say “maybe it's also particularly gentle that, in the end, there was someone who refused to even consider giving up on him.” who is the ‘someone’ in your mind? Milsiril? Kabru and the canaries? I loved your analysis, so I’m curious

OH kabru absolutely

milsiril spared him and, decades later, helped him with his physical rehabilitation, but it seems like she more or less gave up on his personhood. no more desires -> no more mithrun as we knew him -> no more mithrun. she spared him because he wasn’t completely devoid of motivation to live, and she used the single motivator he had left to eventually get him to keep himself alive, and she briefly even seemed to want to try and instill some of his old mask (even with the understanding that that’s what it was) back into him, but that fell through immediately and i think with it went her optimism that mithrun would ever… be a person again. “too late now, i guess.”

then the canaries are on good enough terms with him, but they’re practically instructed to treat him like a weapon or a tool they’re maintaining. i believe it’s cithis that tells kabru to take care of mithrun but clarifies that really what that is is just making sure he eats. ensuring his baseline needs for survival are met. and really, that’s all she was ever tasked with. when it’s all over and mithrun is cataleptic, the canaries stay physically near him, but they seem to have accepted that he’s gone—without the demon to chase, he has nothing to live for. cithis, though, seems to be closer to mithrun than any of the others, and i don’t think it’s a coincidence that she’s the one who calls lycion off and encourages kabru to try engaging with him when she hears the beginning of what he has to say.

this post caught a lot of my opinions regarding mithrun’s relationships (linking to my reblog of it because i dumped some thoughts in the tags) but tldr i do think milsiril and the canaries fall short of thinking of mithrun as a person, and that’s why their relationships with him fail him somewhat. i don’t think that’s their fault, because it seems like they were taught to think of losing your desires as a complete loss of self and humanity, but it does mean they see mithrun as someone who has already been lost. kabru is demonstrably different in that he’s able to help mithrun see a future beyond the demon, and he’s able to do it because he deals with mithrun like he’s human. because he is. and all of that stems from the specific aspect of kabru’s personality that is his obsession with people

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Bro even in the anime his English dub voice actor will exaggerate his voice when talking to others about monsters and make him sound unhinged on purpose for the funny or whatever but part of his character is being misunderstood as a freak weirdo when he’s actually just really passionate..

canon v fanon, dunmeshi edition

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Thats just your average male friendship

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I

Fuckin

Agree!

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I 90% blame the few la/bru BNF (Big name fans, aka fandom accounts with a big following) for the way Mithrun is being talked about in the fandom right now. Prior to the airing of the anime, and before those accounts were made/got popular, Mithrun was seen as a tragic but still intimidating and funny character. Or a babygirl, depending.

Now, he's an ugly senile dog with permanent eye stains who is too old and decrepit to function.

Making fun of his eyes is insanely ableist. No need to elaborate tbh.

He is unable to function because of severe trauma, not because of his age. He is the elven equivalent of 37, not 79. If we calculate the half-foot/tallmen age according to their average lifespan, then Chilchuck is about 35. Literally nobody treats Chilchuck like a grandpa, because he is not dysfunctional. Because he is not disabled.

He is incredibly competent at his job. He needs assistance to live, but he is one of, if not the, strongest fighters in the whole series. Reducing him to his disabilities while simultaneously degrading said disabilities is incredibly telling of the posters' character.

Mithrun is being dehumanized and people are uncritically repeating these jokes because it's funny in the moment. It's one thing to poke fun at your faves, it's another to be so unbelievably callous about a character's trauma by reducing it to only jokes.

Chief, I'm gonna level with ya; I'm not going to believe you actually like him when all you ever do is call him a dog that needs to be put down, or act super excited when someone agree with you on how ugly he is, or say that he's fundamentally unsuited for relationships because his disability will always burden his partner.

Just be honest and say you hate him