#ut is vincent's daddy

[xbluexrose]

I thought about this part from the manga.

I comes from shinigami's notes, so it's true. The real father of Vincent IS someone called Cedric K. Ros.

Some people think this is Claudia's mortal husband but since he married her and she didn't changed her family name into his nor he did, it seemed more like an affair.

So, maybe, in mortal's books Vincent is Claudia's hudband's son, but the real father can be found only in shinigami's documents. And shinigami know that father isn't an ordinary man judging of german grim reapers reactions.

For me personally this theory is good enough to say that real Undertaker's name is Cedric K. Ros and he is Vincent's father.

Thank you for reading my speech. :)

[cedric-k-rossignol]

Hi! Afteer readinga lot of posts about claudia x ut recently i really cant still agreewith it💀, and the thing is Claudia Phantomhive wasn't even born or either a very young child when UT deserted from the reaper dispatch so this theory doesn't make sense with the timeline.As someone who has read a lot of theories, they lack the argument that Undertaker lived more than 80+ years and that Francis did not react to him as a father. That theory has no ground to stand on.There rly isn’t actually the timeline doesn’t line up at all UT was retired way before Claudia was even born

Hiya! Agree to disagree and all, but I'm taking this as an invitation to do my favourite activity and step up on my claudiataker soapbox. It also doesn't seem like you've read my theories, but I can't blame you for that cause for real they long as hell ☠️ who got time for that.

It seems like you're more caught up on the idea that Undertaker rebelled against reaper HQ/retired because of Claudia - and it seems you think that he would have to have been a human to be in love with her? And you're right - Claudia was either not born or a very young child around those times. In all my theories I maintain that the reason Undertaker wiped out half of reaper HQ around 70 years before the events of the manga, and the reason why he officially deserted and smuggled out his death scythe 50 years prior to the events of the manga have to do with Queen Victoria, not Claudia. Those dates line up with Victoria's birth year of 1819, and with her ascension to power in 1837. I talked about Undertaker's dissociation from his human life after his suicide in the 14th century, and his return to humanity with the 'Molly G' locket in 1837 in this ask, you might want to check it out. In short, I don't think these events have anything to do with Claudia - Undertaker had his own reasons for doing what he did. He has a moral code separate from Claudia, and I think that's great because women are too often used as a man's moral compass and honestly it's tiring... Like, let us be immoral and evil too, damn...

But why are you dismissing the possibility he and Claudia met and fell in love after he deserted?

"They lack the argument that Undertaker lived more than 80 years". Sorry anon, an 80 year old is still a spring chicken compared to how old I think Undertaker is. I think he was born on March 25, 1331 - which would make him a whopping 558 years old in 1889. Physically, I think he was 34 when he died on January 28, 1366. Again, I don't see how this would prevent him and Claudia from falling in love? I mean it's a bit of a May December romance, I'll give you that, but... I don't understand why this isn't a possibility?

Frances! I adore her! I think she has oodles and oodles of daddy issues!!! And probably a few mommy issues too. I get a very different read on her interactions with Undertaker than you have.

Keep in mind that Frances is a pretty stoic person. She's the antithesis of her daughter Lizzie in that way, who is much more emotionally expressive. Frances, to me, doesn't seem at all pleased to see him. Perhaps even a little pained...

Undertaker making this comment implies he was around at the time of her birth.

Yana has said that Frances takes after their father, whereas Vincent takes after their mother. I think Undertaker, who was devoted to Claudia, found loving Vincent as a father to be natural, easy, and beautiful.

But Undertaker was also someone who committed suicide, and I believe he was mentally ill and had PTSD from his life as a human in 14th century Brittany - nevermind 450 years of witnessing trauma second-hand through watching records, and watching people die in all manner of ways. A parent who hates themself might struggle to love a child who looks so much like them, acts so much like them - this is awful, but it's true. And while stoic, disciplined, stern Frances (with a natural talent for swordsmanship!) might not seem much like Undertaker we've come to know, she sure does sound a lot like reaper 136649.

If that didn't complicate matters enough, Claudia also died while Vincent and Frances were still young - and I don't doubt that Undertaker at the very least emotionally abandoned them both in his grief.

And this isn't even to mention that Undertaker being Vincent's and Frances' father makes them illegitimate - they're technically bastards, living in a world where status and legitimacy are very important as an Earl and a Marchioness.

It's possible Frances blames Undertaker for Claudia's death - and that could be deserved or undeserved. She might blame him for Vincent's death as well, given his parentage is a factor in why he died.

All together, Frances likely holds some serious resentment towards Undertaker, and I think it's completely in line with what we know about her character for her to react coldly to her father's unwelcome and unwanted reappearance in her life, instead of in anger or sorrow.

Less of a ClaudiaTaker take and more of an 'Undertaker was low-key a deadbeat dad' take but there you go!

[abybweisse]

Feral smartass Is really fitting for ut,lol

Also i cant stop imagining claudia and vincent as feral disasters,poor tanaka I geuss

Referring to this post.

Worse for Tanaka when you figure that Francis/Frances is likely either another Feral Disaster or an Angelic Smartass. The Angelic part would be her own, but the Smartass would be taking after her father, which also helps for the pattern of inheritance in the Kuroverse. Now I'm wondering if there's a Friday the 13th not too long (or too soon) after Vincent's birth that would place her as a Feral Smartass, like daddy. 🤔

Anyway, we don't know Tanaka's western zodiac sign... and Yana-san hinted in a tweet years ago that Tanaka's got quite the dark steak himself. I think it's a safe bet he was well-chosen for his role....

[crimsonfacets]

Oh please, there’s judgements here regardless. You know the sort of man she’s married to!

[midnight-in-town]

Serious question though

and I need people’s opinion on the subject:

Do you think Alexis is allowed to call Frances “Frannie” too, or it’s just a special right for Vincent because he’s her big brother? 

Do you think anyone besides Vincent is allowed to call her “Frannie”?

I need to know for… important reasons. :D

imagine if UT is really Cedric K. Ros, and thus her daddy, and at some point in the story they actually interact and he calls her ‘Frannie’ though? And she just loses her shit because they really don’t get along from her point of view but, like, UT doesn’t care and keeps on calling her ‘Frannie’ because she’s his baby girl and because it totally annoys her. Meanwhile Ciel, Liz and Ed just watch the scene and have no idea what’s going on and Seb pretends he doesn’t know any of these humans.

[house-of-slayterr]

Slashers as Tik Tok Quotes:

Billy Lenz:

You: *walk in on Billy wanking it to a fresh corpse* Holy fuck is this wrong-

Billy: *smirking at you*

You: But holy hell, is it erotic!

Bo Sinclair:

Bo: How did you run out of fuel that quickly?!?!

You: I emptied it out.

Bo: Emptied it? Why?

You: *in a duh voice* to make room for the tuna!

Lester Sinclair:

You: Lester there is a cow outside! *points at Vincent*

Lester: This is a cow farm… THERES GONNA BE COWS OUTSIDE!

Vincent Sinclair:

Vincent: Who created the Mona Lisa?

You: Da Vinki?!?!?

Brahms Heelshire:

You: *playing hide and seek tag* is this game popular with autistic people?

Brahms: Why would you say something like that?

You: Cause I’m starting to love it!

Stu Macher:

Stu: *watching slumber party massacre shower scene*

You: Yo! Rated mother fucking PG shit, this shit rated PORN! LETS GET IT!

Billy Loomis:

You: *runs up to Billy* Daddy?

Billy: Do I look like? 👀

Asa Emory:

You: You’re asking me about my theories? I’ve wanted years for somebody to ask me about my theories!

Micheal Myers:

Micheal: *starring blankly at you*

You: You have done nothing but tell me how bored you were. I was the chore, the job you didn’t want to do. To me- to me you were everything!

Freddy Kruger:

Freddy: *too the child he just dreamknapped* Um… want a beer

You: He’s Four!

Freddy: I don’t know what am I supposed to do with him?

Jason Voorhees:

Camper: *hits Jason with a machete*

You: I’m gon’ let god fix it, cause if I fix it IM GOING TO JAIL!

Thomas Hewitt:

Hoyt: *making sexual comments about you*

You: *slams knife on table* this family makes me want to murder People

Bubba Sawyer:

Bubba: *gets back from a hunt*

You: *singing* You’re a stinky baby. You smell so bad. You smell like wet beef, or old tuna salad.

Herbert West:

Herbert: Ut is hot as hell in this fucking ass hot ass room I’m in.

You: *gets reanimated*

Herbert: IS THAT THE GRIM REAPER!!!!

Chucky:

You: *crying* My cat died today

Chucky: Get a new one! *puts on sunglasses*

Tiffany Valentine:

You: Your very beautiful

Tiffany: I know

You: Why do you smell so good?

Tiffany: Because I don’t use deodorant and I only take bubble baths

Sam:

Sam: I’ve had four cups of coffee (bags of Candy) and I can see god! You guys wanna meet a dog?

Jason Dean:

Jason: *talking to you* Don’t you want to become a cult leader? Since the death of god there’s been a vacancy open, you could fill that void!

Hannibal Lecter:

Hannibal: And then I’m gonna eat your girlfriend!

You: No! No! You will not eat my girlfriend!

[afirstratelaugh]

Alright gurly, I finally got a request. I want to know how would Undertaker, Vincent and Sebastian would react to the 'PASS THE SALT DADDY' meme should they be the boyfriend (daddy) to their SO. :3

I LOVE YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS GIRL HAPPY BIRTHDAY BISH(IE) 💖💖!!!

Undertaker:Okay so while the ex-reaper may not have the best eyesight, the boy is SLY and OBSERVANT AF. He’d start to reach for the salt but would correct himself mid-way through and play it off like he was adjusting his hair (we all know that mane gets everywhere). Initially succeeds but then a few minutes later bursts out laughing great work dweeb now you’ve gotta recycle a joke from one of your clients to cover this up with.

Vincent:Okay so first and foremost Vincent is the Queen’s Watchdog, his image and reputation means everything. So when in a moment of poor understanding he manages to get to the salt before his s/o’s father does, he hands it over to him without batting an eye and a murmured ‘Sir’ under his breath. This goes mostly unquestioned by the father but the s/o will DEFINITELY be having words with Vincent about paying more attention to his surroundings.

Sebastian:I apologise for the stale meme but *inhales* BOIIIIII. Three words: he’s a demon. In the story of Kuroshitsuji he’s focused on playing his role as a butler convincingly and so his response to this event isn’t a concern. But once you take him out of that situation? He’s a wildcard. I see this going three ways: he either doesn’t respond at all and allows the father to assume entire responsibility (wise choice); he responds in a way similar to UT or Vincent; or he decides to be absolutely shameless and publicly tease his s/o for not being more specific in their choice of words (probably the most likely tbh).

[midnight-in-town]

I love your comparison with Zeke Jaeger! I never thought about it, but now I totally see it. (It’s too early to know, of course.) From what /I/ see so far, I think maybe the resurrection of RC has amplified his bad sides? Making him more possessive of OC. Obviously if he was a pawn for the killers, regardless if he expected his parents to die or not, something scary was definitely driving him. The future development will be so interesting. He seemed to feel guilty on the past, ->

Hi Anon, thanks for reading. :)) 

Of course, this isn’t a full comparison since Zeke clearly has had strong daddy issues for a while when real!Ciel’s motive might be tied more directly to his brother, but I found the slight resemblance interesting. 

About zombie!real!Ciel though, yes I agree and it’s something I and several others have mentioned before. When you look at bizarre dolls in general, even if we don’t know whether real!Ciel was brought back by UT or not, well…

they always had violence and obsession as common points. 

It might be because UT said that BDs tended to seek what they lacked, or it might simply be his method of using the “episodes” within the cinematic records (yearning for the future: in real!Ciel’s case => “staying with my little brother”, making real!Ciel a more perfect version of Derrick and Agares), but my personal opinion is that the whole process of bringing the dead back to “life” is so unnatural anyway that it’s bound to never work perfectly. 

The other explanation where real!Ciel is concerned could be that…

his time with the cult 4 years ago and him being sacrificed were such traumatizing events that he became crazy while on the brink of death and it’s something that stayed even when he was brought back (because let’s be honest here, our!Ciel fares much better than he did 4 years ago thanks to going back to a life where he had caring servants, loving family and friends, even if he tried to push all that away). 

Also about the twin, again I agree that if the RCMT is correct, then…

the massacre of the entire household was unplanned. However, it’s just my opinion but considering his weird reaction in this scene…

…I know it’s absolutely horrible (though @dorkshadows will surely like it), but my current take on the RCMT is that 

maybe Vincent and Rachel were the only targets in real!Ciel’s initial plan, for a reason I explained here (hence why I find there might be a resemblance with Zeke Jaeger in the first place)

or maybe real!Ciel took his “ally”’s words for it that they had a solution to his problem and when he found their parents dead, he realized a little too late what that solution was (which is similar to your idea that he went with the flow and took the ring).

Maybe that’s why there is such a strong focus on real!Ciel taking the ring with barely a reaction about their parents’ death and the ring representing his wish to “start over together”. Maybe for the year and a half after this scene…

…he couldn’t hide how bitter he was to have to become Earl Phantomhive when our!Ciel would become a toymaker and leave for London, which is what the mastermind used against him. 

So, when December 14th came and if the RCMT is correct, real!Ciel at least muzzled the dog because he knew someone was coming to do something. The question now is, did he count on the plan leading to his parents’ death or did he just realize too late what the “plan” to help his wish was? At this point it’s hard to say, even if @thedarkestcrow rightfully pointed out to me that the first option is maybe too extreme since real!Ciel didn’t hate his family.

Sorry for the long post, it’s just one possibility and my opinion, so it could be 100% off. 

Thanks for sharing your thoughts Anon and have a lovely day too!