#that doesn't exist for the tpm novel

[jewishcissiekj]

the three genders: Mustafar choking scene (movie), Mustafar choking scene (novelization) and Mustafar choking scene (script)

[this-acuteneurosis]

I kind of want to get you started on mind tricks. cause like weak minded to strong minded dynamic and the blur away, but also the sith back in the day were for SURE a Caste system of force sensitive rulers and non force sensitives, and the jedi were their ENEMY off and on for thousands of years, cultural bleed through and dynamics of their own power systems but Ben we are not the droids you are looking for go away so I dont have to kill you, versus Qui hey I want this thing trade it for me.

Alright, Oct anon, it's been a while, but I have not forgotten you definitely forgot this ask in my drafts for who even knows how many months but it's found again, whoo!

It's taken me a while to get this together partly to try and arrange my thoughts in a logical order but also...

Guys, I really, really care about the use of agency in stories. Like, I've ranted about it in relation to droids, I've explained some of my problems with it in the context of the thematic changes between the OT and the PT, I stew over it constantly in my brain, it's a central theme of many of my own stories (including DLB).

I really don't like mind control, and not just in Star Wars.

Now, just because I don't like a thing doesn't mean it doesn't have a place in story telling. As a device, mind control/manipulation can be useful or important to a plot. To a theme. Overcoming it can be powerful or cool (Ella Enchanted-I prefer the novel personally, Tanjiro in Demon Slayer: Mugen Train), watching someone succumb to it can be agonizing (Frodo in Return of the King, anyone? Princess Euphemia in Code Geass?).

So, what is the point of Mind Tricks (and that naming choice, "trick," making it sound almost...harmless) in the Star Wars story, and maybe in the universe?

I feel like in its initial reveal, the mind trick was supposed to a) convey how "magical" Jedi were and b) get the plot from point A to B. Obi-Wan waves his hand, someone believes something hideously untrue, move along move along, don't think about it too hard.

Like, literally, audience, please. Don't.

Luke uses it in RotJ for pretty much the same reason. To convery a) Luke is well on his way to being a "magical" Jedi now (oh but wait, there's more character growth he needs!), and b) Luke needs to get into Jabba's palace and why would they let him in? Because he says so, so we will take him to Jabba now. Move along, move along.

I don't like the implications of this power existing, and as an adult who has been in situation where I have to report to higher powers, the disregard of the consequences of these things are a bit darker if I look too closely, but like...move along, I guess. It's fine as long as we're only using these powers on space nazis and slavers. Right?

Except then we get more movies. And cartoons. It's fine if Obi-Wan mind controls a person into not smoking, right? Smoking is Bad and Obi-Wan is Good.

Only.

Only...

Who taught Obi-Wan to use mind tricks?

Ah yes, my old nemesis.

To all you Qui-Gon fans out there, you may wanna leave. This analysis is probably not for you.

So like, Qui-Gon Jinn. Qui-Gon "I'm friends with the current Chancellor and thus an obvious, notable representative of the Jedi Order but I don't get along with my higher ups" Jinn. The thing you have to understand about my opinion of him is that, as a young, first time watcher of TPM, I liked him. He was funny, irreverent, direct. He was wise, or at least seemed to know things no one else did. He was a maverick, ready to go against all orders and advice for what he knew was right. And everyone around him was just stuffy and uninformed.

And to be fair, he wasn't wrong about everything. He's set up to be sympathetic. He's trying to treat with the gungans and they won't listen? Well he and Obi-Wan are right, the Trade Federation does go for the gungans. The Order says there are no Sith? Oops, wrong on that one. The Council makes the ambiguous assertion Anakin is "too old" to train. We've seen the OT. We know "too old" is nonsense.

But like, what does Qui-Gon do when he's thwarted?

He takes away people's agency.

Oh, you don't want to help us, Boss Nass, political leader? Cool, well I'm gonna undermine you in front of your entire court and you're gonna give us a whole ship (that we won't return) to help us defend a people you've been in an active war with for centuries. Oh, my currency doesn't work on this planet? I think it will mister small time junk dealer with a gambling problem (jokes on you for that one, sir).

This to me is a huge red flag in a story that is about literal slaves. I know people will defend the above examples. It was necessary. There were lives at stake.

You wanna know who would have suffered if Qui-Gon had been able to con Watto out of that part?

Anakin and Shmi.

Worthless (or event mostly worthless) currency on a planet where you have to buy water is literal death under the right circumstances. And who do you think Watto's going to reduce rations on. He's got cash flow problems? What's the quickest way for him to make back what he just lost? I'll give you a hint, he gambles on them later in the exact same movie.

So like, well before we get to "weak minded" or anything dubious like that, there's this awkward question of, "Why are the good guys always using powers to make people do things? And not worried about the consequences?"

And like, if we go back to simple story narratives, and trying to move things from point A to point B, that's fine I guess. I enjoy the OT. I'll move along.

But if you ask me to stop and think about it.

Well...

[the-far-bright-center]

So glad you agree! SW fandom can be really bizarre about Qui-Gon's character. They fixate on the weirdest things, make bad faith interpretations, and completely miss the point of his role in the story. Yes, absolutely, it is implied Qui-Gon would have gone back for Shmi. He was in a very difficult position in TPM....he was pressed for time to get back to Coruscant and then to Naboo (a war zone). When he said he hadn't come to free slaves, he didn't mean that he personally didn't WANT to free the slaves (on the contrary, he goes out of his way to try to free both Shmi and Ani). In my opinion, that statement is NOT supposed to be an indictment of Qui-Gon as an individual; it is more of a commentary on the priorities of the Jedi Order and the Republic that the Order serves. (See also Padme’s surprise and dismay that slavery still exists in the galaxy.) What Qui-Gon is saying is that his official *mission* is to help Naboo and to get back to Coruscant—that's what he was sent to do. It’s just a fact. He wants to be HONEST with Shmi so she doesn't have false hopes or expectations, especially since he's not yet sure if he can intervene with her and Ani at that point. All his interactions with Shmi are very warm and affectionate, to the point that 13 year old me shipped Qui-Gon x Shmi really hard! They had amazing chemistry. All their scenes are portrayed as though they are a adoptive family (sitting around a table, his hand on her shoulder, him being fatherly toward Ani, etc). There's no way Qui-Gon would just forget about Shmi and never come back to free her. But he had to get back to Coruscant and I'm sure he knew it would already be quite fraught to bring Ani back to the Temple as it was, let alone with his mother in tow. Qui-Gon asks Shmi if she will be alright, and she says yes. Shmi wants Ani to go with him, she trusts him completely to care for her son, based on how she's seen him be with Anakin during his time on Tatooine. (And don't forget Padme is there too, Shmi sees how kind Padme is. In the TPM novelization, Padme even feels that Shmi wants her to look out for Ani.) And Shmi is not wrong to trust Qui-Gon, if we base things simply on a judgment of his character and actions. He DOES stand up for little Ani in those cold Council chambers. He puts Ani's needs first. It's just the twist of fate and the fact Qui-Gon doomed by the narrative that removes him from that much-needed protective position in Ani’s life. But if Qui-Gon had lived, I have no doubt he'd have gone back for Shmi. How would he have continued caring for Ani so warmly and NOT at least made sure Ani knew she was ok, you know? My headcanon has always been that if he survived the Duel of the Fates, he'd have taken Ani and trained him elsewhere, outside of the Jedi Order. This would have kept Ani from Sidious’ grasp. And this would have also allowed them to go back for Shmi, free her, and even have her live with them or near them while Ani trained. And then, yes, everything you say above is certainly how things would pan out in that Happy (or at least, Happier) AU scenario. :')

Qui-Gon Jinn: the ideal teacher of Anakin Skywalker

an excerpt from TPM novelization

Keep reading

[maeve-on-mustafar]

How the Jedi Council failed Anakin

Over the past several years, Anakin's first meeting with the Jedi Council has become a topic of heated debate, and there are various takes. I've had my own for a while, but I recently stumbled across a paragraph in the TPM novelization that helped cement my perspective.

Inside, Anakin Skywalker faced the Jedi Council, standing in the same place Qui-Gon Jinn had stood some hours earlier. He was nervous at first, brought into the chamber by Qui-Gon, then left alone with the twelve members of the Council. Standing in the mosaic circle and ringed by the silent assemblage, awestruck and uncertain of what was expected of him, he felt vulnerable and exposed. The eyes of the Jedi were distant as they viewed him, but he sensed they were looking not past him, but inside.

They began to question him then, without preliminary introductions or explanations, without expending any effort at all to make him feel comfortable or welcome. He knew some of them by name, for Qui-Gon had described a few, and he was quick to put faces to names. They questioned him at great length, testing memory and knowledge, seeking insights at which he could only guess. They knew of his existence as a slave. They knew of his background on Tatooine, of his mother and his friends, of his Podracing, of Watto, of everything factual and past, of the order of his life.

-From Star Wars: Episode I The Phantom Menace novelization, by Terry Brooks

Emphasis mine on those three sentences. There has been some discussion and debate as to whether the Jedi Council knew if Anakin had been a slave, if Qui-Gon had kept them informed, etc. Here's official clarity on the subject: they knew everything, and they still decided to have no sympathy for Anakin and his situation.

I'm no Jedi hater by any means, and Mace Windu is my favorite Jedi after Anakin. But I've thought for a long time that this scene embodied how the Jedi had lost their way by this era.

Even though Anakin was someone who could have used the Jedi's help and compassion the most, a former child slave who had spent the first nine years of his life being considered a piece of property rather than a person and who had a bomb implanted in his spine to make sure he could never escape. And in spite of this traumatic upbringing, the Jedi Council does nothing to help him. They don't offer him any sympathy or comfort. They don't try to explain to him that he's safe, they don't even explain to him what he's being tested for. They take a traumatized child and start questioning him without context, and then later declare him unfit for training because he's too old, too afraid, and too angry.

I've seen some other Jedi fans try to recontextualize this scene as Yoda and the Council trying to offer Anakin therapy, with Anakin being the one who's in the wrong for lying about being afraid. But that interpretation makes no sense. Therapy for a traumatized child doesn't take place in a group of twelve strangers who are evaluating said child's fitness to be a warrior monk. They can't simultaneously be offering Anakin therapy while also deciding that his need for therapy makes him unsuitable to be a Jedi. (Which, incidentally, would not only be a conflict of interest, but also mental health shaming and discrimination, and also the exact opposite of compassion.)

Also, therapy for a child certainly doesn't take place without someone specifically and purposefully explaining to the child what's happening and that the session is meant to help them., Meanwhile, this book passage explicitly mentions the Council didn't explain anything to him or even introduce themselves. And finally, therapy doesn't involve shaming traumatized children for their fears, or holding the child's very real and warranted fears of loss from a lifetime in slavery against them.

One point I want to clarify: I don't think the Council failed Anakin by initially refusing to accept him into the Order. They thought he was too damaged to bother with and didn't want to take the time to train him/help him? Pretty heartless, IMHO, but let's be real: today's US Supreme Court would probably back them up on this decision.

I think the failure is contained within this line "They began to question him then, without preliminary introductions or explanations, without expending any effort at all to make him feel comfortable or welcome."

I've argued before that even if the Council didn't want Anakin in the Order, they still could have found ways to help him. Offering him medical care because he probably had health issues from spending, y'know, nine years as a slave. Offering him clean clothes. Getting him a meal. Treating him with the slightest iota of sympathy or kindness or trying understand why he might be afraid instead of treating his fear like an instantaneous path to the dark side, (which it isn't, anyway).

And the TPM novelization confirmed that none of this happened. The Jedi Council failed Anakin--not because they didn't want him as a Jedi, but because they decided an abused child who'd been deprived of rights his entire life was beneath their compassion. And compassion is a trait the Jedi prize themselves on, so why could they not find it within themselves to offer it here, to someone who desperately needed it?

And the conclusion I'm left with is this: because the Jedi at this point weren't actually all that great at being compassionate. They decided Anakin wasn't worth it, and that was that. He didn't meet their standards of what a Jedi candidate should be, therefore he wasn't useful to them, and therefore, they weren't going to expend any effort to help him. They clearly didn't care what happened to him afterward, because then they just allowed Qui-Gon to take him back to an active war zone on a hostile planet.

People complain about Qui-Gon having a reputation in dudebro circles as "the one good Jedi", but let's be honest: he spent a good forty minutes of the movie being kind to Anakin and Shmi and tried to free both of them. The Jedi Council can't be bothered to try to help Anakin (or his mother) at all during the three minutes of the movie they're on screen.

(Of course, if you want a Doylist perspective, the alternative reason is that George Lucas maybe isn't the best at character writing and forgot to include a scene where his order of compassionate warrior monks actually are compassionate.)

Don't get me wrong: the Jedi Council gets a lot of bad takes in fandom. I find Mace's fandom-wide mischaracterization as infuriating the next fan.

But let's be real: the Council didn't exactly cover themselves in glory here, and it's kind of appalling that not one of the twelve adults in the room could find in themselves to be kind to a traumatized child slave.

[qqueenofhades]

I always saw Obi-Wan as an asexual kind of guy. Maybe that's because I'm old enough to remember when we only had the OT and he was already old. And dead for most of it. Anyway, part of why I love Star Wars is the emphasis on friendships and how strong and rewarding they can be without romantic feelings (although Han/Leia was my first ship). May we all have such people in our lives. All interpretations are valid of course and people love what they love, just wanted to share another point of view!

I mean, that's basically how I also envision him: my "Obi-Wan Kenobi as queer text" meta described my personal headcanon of him as biromantic asexual, and that's what the other post seemed to be hinting at in: re whatever they put in the book. After all, remember kids, ignore the exclusionists: asexuality is a full and complete queer identity on its own, and doesn't need other modifiers or qualifiers to be considered legitimate. So yeah. But as I said, he has radiated such intense bisexual sass disaster energy for the longest time, and I am frankly shocked that the Disney overlords allowed even a single sentence in a YA book that might hint at confirming this. To be honest, I don't care one way or another what the Mouse says about anything, particularly SW canon, since I reject what they have done with most of it. But hey. It's nice to have anyway.

As I also mentioned in the tags, Obi-Wan is a particularly formative character for me as a queer adult, since some of my first-ever forays into fandom, fic, and slash came as a result of reading TPM-era fics with him back in the dark days, with badly designed Web pages and SLASH!! content warnings. I imprinted on him as queer long before I knew what that was either for him or for me, and so I have a certain nostalgic perspective on it. (Also, nobody could read the Revenge of the Sith novelization in 2005, come out totally emotionally destroyed, and go, "yeah, Obi-Wan is totally straight." Even if I didn't, again, actually consciously realize this at the time.)

Likewise, Obi-Wan's appearance in the original trilogy has always fit the "celibate or asexual wise-old-mentor" stereotype, who exists mostly to guide the hero but doesn't have particular passions or motivations of his own. Then they cast Ewan McGregor as the younger version of him, and Ewan McGregor is likewise very attractive. But then in prequel-verse, all of Obi-Wan's most formative and important emotional relationships were with men (Qui-Gon, Bail Organa, etc) and then, of course, Anakin and the "it's a love story" Obi-Wan Kenobi series. So the more canon we got past just Alec Guinness, the more intensely Obi-Wan read as queer to me. The man cannot even sit straight (see his pose in the Council seat in ROTS), drops his cloaks with utter drama, sasses people, and is the utter opposite of toxic masculinity. He just has Big Queer Energy, in other words, and I felt it for a long time before I was able to properly name it in either him or myself.

Indeed, Obi-Wan would read pretty clearly as gay to me, except for the fact that they apparently added in some pseudo-girlfriend in the Clone Wars animated series and other assorted female interests in the expanded-universe books. Which, quite frankly, can't help but sound like "welp, this famous and beloved character is TOO queer-coded, better add in some comphet to tone that down." However, aside from my personal attachment to queer Obi-Wan, there's another aspect to it which I think is touching and important, and that is the fact that Luke is also often headcanoned as queer/gay/bi of some description (which Mark Hamill has enthusiastically supported). Considering that the original trilogy came out in the late '70s and early '80s, just as we were losing what should have been our entire generation of gay/queer ancestors to AIDS, I would find it very lovely if Luke, a queer man, was being mentored by Obi-Wan, his queer elder, in a way that we were so often denied the chance to have in reality. So yes. There are a lot of layers to it, in my view, and as I said, I don't care whether they bother to put one sentence in an EU book or not. The heart knows what it knows. Ahem. ;)

[couldnt-think-of-a-better-name]

Reaching Paradise

I am terribly sorry for the inactivity, life has been very hectic! I do want to get back on answering asks, but I wanted to just share thoughts on chapter 136 first, if a bit belatedly.

The chapter cover is very clearly a reference to Alice growing giant in the White Rabbit's house. Emma is even standing in what looks very similar to a rabbit hole.

I have discussed this with @ , and I hope that the inclusion of the Anna and Nat chibis are a foreshadowing to them having an important part later on.

I have said in a post before that Norman doesn't stand a chance against Son-ju unless he gets information about his abilities, and a chance to make a plan against him, and Norman must know this. This is why I think Don and Gilda are wrong to assume Norman sent Aishe with them to kill Son-ju...

I think Norman's plan is to have Aishe gather information on Son-ju, so she will be acting harmless and supportive. What Norman needs the most is info on Son-ju's fighting ability, so I think there is a good chance either him or Aishe will provoke a situation where Son-ju has to fight, but rather than fighting against him, she would fight alongside him and observe.

Also note the white birds on the cover, I think they are meant as references to doves, which are representation of the holy spirit and pentecost. Interestingly; we do have spirits appear later in the chapter...

Speaking of Alice in Wonderland references, I did miss a couple, like the time when Alice as a giant, knocked over the jury-box filled with a load of animals, which looked just like the animal toys Emma and Ray stumbled into:

Or just the confusing signs navigating her in essentially a maze in Wonderland, which we know Emma and Ray also experiences...

But speaking of references, it is made clear this chapter that I was absolutely right to draw a parallel with The lion the witch and the wardrobe. In that novel, just like in TPM, the wardrobe is a portal to entirely different worlds of existence.

I wonder if we will see more of the lion, since we did see a lion plushie in that extra sketch with Shirai-san being sick.

Speaking of references, I am increasingly sure that the Dante's Divine Comedy parallels are real.

Purgatory is full of lost souls who wander for eons in order to purify themselves of their sins and get to Paradise.

(Tbh, the soul theme is also fitting for Pentecost, a holiday celebrating the Holy Spirit...)

Once Dante reaches the 7th terrace of Purgatory, he is finally purified, by having to walk through fire. He can then enter the Earthly Paradise, the same one that Adam and Eve were banished from.

Interestingly, every time that a soul completed the trials of Purgatory, the mountain shook with an earthquake... that makes me think of this part of the 7 walls riddle:

The earth screaming and an earthquake sound at least vaguely similar, right?

Inside the Earthly Paradise, Dante encounters Beatrice, who he had believed lost until then, which again is vaguely familiar of Ray believing Emma lost, but then encountering her again at the end.

Then Beatrice tells Dante to look into the sun, and after he stares into it, he starts to see two suns instead of one, and his body becomes so light, he starts to fly to heaven to meet with God, along with Beatrice.

I have mentioned it before that I suspected this cover to reference Dante's flight through Heaven, but I actually think that him gazing into the sun is the solution to a part of the Seven Walls riddle...

Ray says that the "when the sun sets in the East" is a reference to reversing time, since the sun rises in the East and sets in the West, so only if you reverse that will you get the "sun setting in the East".

But I think there is another solution: if you mirror the setting sun, the mirror image will set in the East, while the original sets in the West. Mirrors had been a theme in the series, but perhaps they don't have to physically use a mirror....

The condition may already be met if they trick their brains by staring into the sun for a moment, then turning East. If you stare into the sun, you will see an afterimage afterwards, perhaps creating an illusion of the sun setting in the East. This is easily doable, unlike Ray's idea of reversing time, which humans can't normally do.

Ray also assumes that the arrow stopping in the sand signifies time stopping. But what about a simpler interpretation? Until they entered the desert area, arrows kept constantly appearing, but once they stepped out onto sand, the arrows have stopped (appearing). So could they have already met that condition?

I wonder if Ray's assumption on what the seven walls are is really accurate. Emma questions it, since the way the riddle is phrased, it is implied that the Seven Walls haven't appeared yet, and they will be an obstacle to pass once the rest of the riddle is solved.

But perhaps it just means that they had to figure out the bit about the time and space to be able to progress into the next part, the desert land, which is Purgatory's analogy.

What I find a fascinating parallel though is that squiggly demon!God is described as existing outside of time and space. This is exactly how the Empyrean, the dwelling place of God in Dante's Divine Comedy is described as well. So I think this is another possible analogy.

I have ran out of images, but I also loved the new cover extra with the rain and umbrellas. It really looks like each child is in a bubble, protected underwater! Can't wait to see the significance of rain in the actual manga, that has been foreshadowed before too. We must be close.

Also, note that the first "planet" that Dante visits is the Moon, which has also been foreshadowed to have a significance...

[kanansdume]

Anakin never really discusses the way the Republic treats Outer Rim worlds, though, and certainly, as far as I can recall from the films alone, never brings it up as a reason for why he thinks the system is broken. His one scene where he sort-of discusses why he thinks the system is broken in AOTC only has him say that he thinks that people should sit down, discuss the issue, come up with a solution, and then do it. Which to me implies that his problem is more at how slow the Senate is rather than a specific issue with how they tend to treat Outer Rim worlds. While you're not wrong that this is an issue the Republic Senate HAS, I just don't think it's a problem that ANAKIN has with the Republic Senate. I don't think it's something Anakin thinks all that much about just given what we do see him discuss wrt politics the few times he does so.

I'll also add that Padme has actually suffered just as much under the Republic's problems. In TPM, Padme is fighting the Senate at nearly every turn to try to get aid to her planet and keeps getting told no because Reasons X, Y, Z. She eventually says "if you want a thing done, you have to do it yourself" and runs off to make a deal with the Gungans, obviously, but her experience with the problems within the Republic's system don't ever turn her against the Republic, they just make sure she's ready to fight against its corruption. She's probably the one most familiar with the problems of the Republic Senate, and also the one most ready to stand up for it and fight for it. Between their two backgrounds, PADME should be the one prepared to go full fascist and ANAKIN should be the one fighting hard for democracy and the Republic, and instead it's the opposite.

It'd be interesting I think to have seen more of how Leia had to build up the New Republic in the films, to see more of the effort that had to go into building up a government from literal ashes. Even 30 years in, you could go into like "ok now that you're settled and established, WHAT ABOUT THESE ISSUES" or something to that ilk and have that be a running theme through the films. If they hadn't, ya know, destroyed the New Republic all in one blow and left them with nothing but ashes. Again. You're not wrong that this WOULD be an issue to deal with, something that Leia might be up against, especially as someone who'd been in the Rebellion for a while. It's too bad they chose not to do that lol.

From what we've seen of what Disney's currently pushing, I think it's more likely they're going to bury the ST with PT/OT content lol. We're getting TONS of Prequel and OT content right now with the Kenobi show, Andor, Ahsoka, even fucking Bad Batch. Mandalorian/BOBF, too. The latest novels that have come out seem more PT/OT oriented, too. But we're seeing little to nothing for ST-era content and characters, really. They seem to be IGNORING the ST rather than trying to promote it over nostalgic PT/OT stuff. They won't make it non-canon, but they'll probably just end up pretending it doesn't exist by just never making extended content like books/comics/TV shows set in that era.

Broke: The reason Anidala is so toxic is because Anakin had PTSD that no one recognized or tried to treat.

Woke: The reason Anidala is so toxic is because Padme had PTSD that no one recognized or tried to treat.

Bespoke: Anakin had PTSD that the Jedi teachings would've helped him manage and overcome had Palpatine not interfered and poisoned Anakin against those teachings and encouraging him to lean into behaviors and habits that exacerbated his own PTSD which directly led to his behavior towards Padme and in their relationship that caused issues. In contrast, Padme had PTSD that she chose to set aside in order to keep functioning as Queen for the next three years and never dealt with or managed and cannot function without burying herself in work and in service of some kind which is why she sacrifices all of her childhood dreams of having a family to be a senator when asked after her terms end and she routinely refuses and rejects the care of people who truly care about her like her family and hides things from them in favor of playing out a fantasy with someone who cannot judge her for her own issues and isn't interested in her as a person enough to go looking or notice them anyway.

[gffa]

is it just me or is it weird that the rots novelization isn't canon anymore? i think "if it was written today, we'd have added in stuff that didn't exist back then" is, like, different to "this contains plot lines, characters, settings, characterisations etc. that are not compliant with how we want the story to be". just because ahsoka wasn't mentioned doesn't mean that the rest isn't canon compliant anymore? idk it just confuses me to no end star wars is wild

I kind of really agree with you, but I don’t make the rules, I just try to follow them as best I can because it’s their sandbox and all that.  XD  As mentioned, it’s a bit like saying, “Well, the Revenge of the Sith move didn’t mention her, so it’s not canon anymore, either!”I mean, to be fair, the point was that everything from before April 2014 (with the exception of the movies and the TV shows and one comic) was swept aside because they wanted to start fresh and work forward from here.  Going through the list of 100+ novels to look for whatever might not fully contradict what they might want to explore in the future was not a feasible task.  So it’s ALL Legends, one big sweep.But the ROTS novelization is the one that sticks with me because if it had been done the way the TPM and AOTC novels were done--they had like 3-4 hours to discuss the plot with George, then “just make it a good story”--sure, okay, totally agreed.  But it was line-edited by George himself.Other materials might not contain stuff they would add in today, other stuff might contradict what they want to do in the future (like, say, before Rebels existed, if you had a book that said Depa had never had a Padawan, then you would be beholden to that, even though it didn’t yet exist at the time, that’s what they’re trying to avoid), but GEORGE LINE-EDITED THAT BOOK.So, like, I get it.  It’s not canon-compliant because Anakin’s character isn’t in line with who he is under Disney canon, that Ahsoka’s importance to him is a big enough thing that the sheer fact of it it being missing from the ROTS novel means it’s fundamentally incompatible with his character.  This doesn’t mean it’s not still a great book, of course!  But it’s important enough that it had to be swept out with the rest of Legends, too.(BUT STILL.  GEORGE LINE-EDITED THAT BOOK.  IT’S ON PAR WITH THE MOVIE, I CAN’T HELP BUT THINK.  AND THAT DOESN’T MENTION AHSOKA EITHER.)(But it’s also not my playground and I’m not actually mad about it or anything, I still think it’s useful for analyzing Anakin’s character because George was so involved with it, but I accept Disney Canon’s ruling on this.  XD  And, to be fair, thoughts versus words is a big enough distinction that I can see, “Well, he’s thinking about her, but he’s not talking about her.” because 100% Anakin Skywalker Did Not Talk About His Problems Very Well.)

[helbertinelli]

#it makes me so mad they erased her whole story#and just made her pregnant girl number 3 😒

It just got cut out from the movie. There's still deleted scenes of it and it does exist in the ROTS comic book and I haven't read the ROTS novelization, but it might be in there too since the books usually have a lot of details that the movies didn't include. It still exists for people to see it, just not in the final cut of the movie. But it is everywhere else. They didn't erase her whole story. Padme is way more than her job and the rebellion. She's not just "pregnant girl number 3" as you put it just because she's not constantly working or fighting. ROTS is mainly Anakin's story, just as TPM was mainly Padme's story. Just because they didn't include scenes with Padme forming the rebellion doesn't mean she's suddenly useless. Padme was always at the core of Star Wars and specifically in ROTS she's the driving force for the plot. Also, the whole Padme forming the rebellion sub-plot is still available and part of her story even if it's not shown in the movie. It's honestly not important to show who formed the rebellion. If people can't respect Padme unless she is shown to be the person who formed the rebellion, then that's on them. It doesn't make Padme just some useless pregnant girl and not only that, but being pregnant and focusing on her pregnancy and her family doesn't diminish Padme's character in any way. It's sexist to claim that a woman's worth is less because she's pregnant and not constantly working to fix the messes that other people make and she would have been better if she was shown to be involved in politics and in her career while she was pregnant. There's no right way to be a woman and I hate the standards that women are held to (especially in fiction). They always have to be perfect and have no feelings, but they also have to care about everyone else and put everyone else before themselves. It's just sexist as hell. And I've noticed this sexist behavior being applied towards Padme so often. Like if she does anything else other than being a perfect Senator or shooting a blaster, people think it's misogyny and she's suddenly a weak character.

Some of y’all don’t know there’s an entire subplot that got scrapped from Revenge of the Sith where Padmé helps form the Rebellion with Bail Organa and Mon Mothma and it SHOWS.