#sorry for the ranting tone but i'm sick of how universally accepted that theory is on reddit

[jozor-johai]

really quick I have got to say.

I really hate the theory that so many seem to have bought in on that the Other are in any way literally related to Craster's sons. People put so much stake into that line of dialogue from Craster's wives as being literally true when I think we really have every reason not to think that's the case.

I have a ton to say about this, if anyone is interested, but for the moment, I'm going to point to the newly uncovered Storm of Swords draft that reddit user gsteff reported on yesterday.

There's a line of cut dialogue where Jon and Mance are atop the wrecked Fist of the First Men:

"Who did this?" Jon said. "No men of women born." Mance Raydar had been kneeling over a corpse that looked like Brown Bernarr, but now he stood.

I completely agree with the decision to cut this line, because we'd be theorizing to this day about why the hell Mance knows the nature of the Others, but I think it's an incredibly tangible sign that behind the scenes, in his mind, GRRM is thinking of the Others as "no men of women born."

My interest in this as also a clear Macbeth reference could be its own post, but for now—no men of women born! These are not anyone's sons, let alone Crasters!