#n (intentional or not) narratives of abuse victims having to forgive their abuser and or ignore the harm done to them!!

[greatgoddyke]

this is petty n most likely an issue of ive just been exposed to entirely different shit but those posts about how people complaining about redemption arcs is bad bc its important message that people can change is just completely ignoring why people are actually complaining cause the big two examples i can think of for why people complain about redemptions are 1. the redemption is poorly written n ignores and/or retcons the previous seriousness of their wrongdoings just because the writer(s) want them to be good now n its kind of hard to do that if (for example) we take the lives they intentionally n mercilessly killed into account and 2. this character is an abuser but instead of taking accountability n bare minimum apologizing n letting their victim(s) choose whether they wish to still have them in their life the writer(s) choose a narrative where the abuser doesnt really have to change as a person they just dont abuse anyone anymore n the framing is weirdly unsympathetic to their victim(s)

[ae-neon]

so you’re saying that n/ and rhys would be “better” coz they’ve both been sexually abused? lol if that’s the case why not gwyn? or lucien? i thought you’re actually over this cracksp

Are you insane?? This is not a topic to be used in this way, please. I literally tagged that it's not a ship post at all.

What I said is that the narrative can't address this in the canon relationship because F is his victim and with the way SJM writes - it would just end up with F forgiving him and saying he did what he had to do and it was so hard for him etc. Which is literally what happened in acomaf with SJM using F to forgive and then washing away all his sins.

If you want to frame his working through this in a (romantic or platonic) relationship with other characters who have similar experiences you are free to do so. I literally just said imagine if they got along better.

Again this isn't the sort of topic to use for pettiness. I'm sorry if my post might have come across that way but that wasn't the intention at all

[papers4me]

Fruits Basket, Se03. ep 7 (part 1)

Just to clarify, the only thing I didn’t like abt this ep is tohru, the rest is so good. kyo’s mental state is at its lowest & you can feel for him! ugh!, surprisingly akito’s own lid was so well-done!, Ren & shigure were epicly disgusting & fascinating!, kureno was so well-written, the final scene of tohru & kyo rightfully setting for the climax! Before moving on to the good part,  I’ll quickly go over why torhu’s character was once again the most inconsistent character in the show:

Ep,6 ending showed us a completely broken kyo in full display in front of tohru, best furuba cliff hanger to date hands down, followup: tohru laughing, cooking & wondering if kyo is asleep!!!. Complete detachment & extreme insensitivity to what she witnessed earlier. Not an ounce of wonder if kyo is okay or if sth is wrong with him. Not a single inner thought of “ I hope he’s okay” or “ oh momiji don’t call him, He’s a bit tired” while flashbaking to his traumatized face. Honestly, all they needed to do was a small quick inner thought to connect the scenes. No need to write new scenes. Alas, Tohru’s complete lack of compassion struck me deep. I was told ep6 ending was an anime original scene, I don’t mind any diversion from the original since I don’t know the it, but those writers who wrote a complete new scene didn’t feel the need to transition from it to the rest of the manga? really? It’s hard to believe.

Choosing the kitchen’s happy scene after of kyo’s nightmare is not bad as it shows that nobody either care or know abt his issues, fair enough. However, choosing the kitchen’s happy scene after the PTSD in tohru’s own bedroom & not modifying tohru’s happy go lucky, let’s cook yay face to a realistic concerned expression is absurd! It really takes plenty from tohru as a character. This comes after tohru’s long awaited background ep which returns tohru back to square one.

Just last ep, tohru opened her lid in front of kyo & he comforted her, While she still yet to overcome her fears, she failed miserably in doing the only thing that she’s been doing since se01, ep1, being compassionate & thoughtful. Oh well, adding a light scene in the midst of kyo & akito’s dark sequence is more important than tohru’s character consistency & growth.

moving on from tohru~~~

-Kyo’s suffocation: (guilty or not, it doesn’t matter)

we get kyo’s nightmare really gave me chills & was visually well-done. it brilliantly conveyed the feeling of suffocation, blinding fear, & intensified trauma. The nightmare’s horror vividly showcases kyo’s deepest insecurities & trauma:

It started with his mother’s “ it’s not your fault” sth kyo craved to hear from her very badly. Yet, it contradicted her action: Choosing death over staying with him.

His mother brings salvation: the cat’s cage. The cat’s room parallel’s kyo’s real life at his parents house. In se01, eo24, kyo said, he wasn’t allowed to play outside or watch TV, while his bracelet ”handcuffs”  were routinely checked by his mom. Just like a prison. His mom sentenced him in the new prison fitting for more horrible sins. The cat’s cage for the rest of his life.

While kyo looks panicked & horrified but on the verge to refuse, kyoko appears. “I won’t forgive you” solidifying his mom’s judgement.

They both warn him of the consequences of living & be forgiven: tohru’s death. Go on, kyo. Add one more victim to suffer in your behalf while you roam free. You might think that you can escape the cat’s cage but your hands remain dirty with blood. Others might not see the blood on yoyr hands, but YOU do.

Kyo is torn between being an actual sinner or a victim, between causing intentional harm or unintentional hurt, between being guilty or not. It all doesn’t matter & kyo knows it. What matter is the punishment has been going for years now & he’s tired, broken, lost & just wants it all to end. Death. Slow death in a tiny cage is so fitting for all the pain he caused others, for all the pain he suffered.

Kyo knows (a) suffering in front of tohru is hurting her. (b) Accepting her love will lead to hurting her: confessing of kyoko’s death. (c) Abandoning her is hurting her. (d) kyo knows that he doesn’t deserve her, not after he caused all this pain. (e) Above all, kyo can’t live with himself anymore. being close to her hurt so much.

-Akito’s lid: ( broken home & broken self image):

I must say they did an excellent job of presenting akito’s past! (a) It was a mixture of narration through (shigure & Ren), (b) actual animation of her parents causing her pain & traumatizing her (the scenes of Akira’s last words, her mom’s accusations), (c) Actual animation of the origin of her parents (Ren & Akira’s relationship), (d) akito herself confessing abt her pain in front of kureno. Tohru’s own lid on the other hands was presented through (a) excessive narrative with minimum animation (the grandpa’s endless exposition of tohru’s background quickly wrapped up), (b) no real animation of kyoko actually hurting tohru or how she did it, just again the grandpa narrating that kyoko “went away”. (c) tohru’s own self recall of her past being cut into pieces & divided throughout the ep, once after running from shigure & another in the sheet scene. Tohru’s ep wasn’t bad at all, it was good, but it was evidently shortened & summarized lazily. Oh well. What both eps serve is painting tohru & akito as foils of each other:

Both are attached toxicly to their parent. Tohru: kyoko & Akito: akira.

Both were welling to create a fake persona or an image that keeps this toxic love alive & cling to it no matter what.

Both hurt themselves the most & are struggling to let go of this bond.

Both have parents that hurt them. Akito: ren & tohru: kyoko, altho it is not clear how kyoko hurt tohru but kyoko is more a ghost than a real character.

Both cling to a dead object that represent their deceased parent. Tohru & the photo frame & akito & the box.

Kyoko existed to be this perfect mother with no sins, the character that tohru embodied to “fix” & “ heal all broken kids”. She lives only in memories. Even other characters think of her as this holy being. It is alluded Kyo seemed to know her as a real person who can commit mistakes, therefore, to kyo, kyoko isn’t an angel or a holy being. However, thanks to their encounter at her death & her “ I won’t forgive you” words, kyoko now is a haunting ghost to kyo. Akira on the other hand, existed as this sickly, pale & fragile head of the house, treated with so much aura & holiness. He died but his sins remain in how he raised akito.

Both must let go of their toxic bonds. Tohru of her deep attachment to her mom & akito to the zodiacs.

Both must learn to form healthier relationships.

However, there are striking differences between them! tohru never abused anyone nor attempted murdering someone by throwing’ em from a terrace, or locking them & torment them or stabbing them with a knife!! Tohru’s sin is torturing herself which by consequence tortured kyo, too. Cuz there’s is a theme of a loved-one’s pain is mine as well. Kyo’s mom hurt her own self & ended her own life. This resulted in her son’s years of immense pain, trauma & self-loath & similar suicidal tendencies, se0, ep16 “ I’ will yuki & then kill myself”, & se02, e9 “ mother, if only you killed me instead”. tragic.

Side Notes:

I will say this with a broken heart....... Tohru must learn to let go of.... kyo.  She is suffocating him. Not on purpose. I want them to be together! so bad! they’re so perfect for each other, but also, right now is NOT the time for this. Kyo & tohru’s character issues is NOT abt romance. They have real traumatic issues that are hindering their growth as independent characters. Tohru’s growth might not be well-written or well-presented, but kyo’s growth is still not explored. Next ep is where his lid opened! it must be painful. A person suffering from extreme self-loath & suicidal tendencies shouldn’t be presented so lightly in favor for the love cures all fairy tale! PLZ! NO!

Tohru must learn to not repeat her mistake again & live only for one person. She must let go of kyo in order to gain kyo back. Right now, She can’t have him! kyo is suffocated by his own trauma & adding tohru’s guilt on top of it is devastating. I mean, This could go differently & kyo might accept her love on the spot, & tohru might save him again or sth. I can see this being going deeper or shallower depending on the desired theme. Which of furuba’s heavy themes will be given to climax?

why is momiji doing a rabbit burger? he’s not cursed anymore. I know he’s keeping it a secret, but I thought momiji’s whole growth was abt letting go of the past. he still identifies with the zodiac rabbit?

Ren is hella sexy! & her Japanese VA deserves an Oscar! The way she expresses sexiness, seductive, anger, hate, contempt, sarcasm, delusional screaming, pain! EPIC!

“I thought I was created to receive others contempt” ugh! this hurt, kyo.

Shigure’s line abt looking at Ren to fantasize how akito will look if she were allowed to be a woman, ewww!!!! hella disgusting! imagine sleeping wth someone & fantasizing abt her daughter or vise versa!

Honestly, this ep while not excusing akito’s crimes & abuse of others, it did paint her in a human light. I really don’t want her to end up with shigure. Akito’s whole life is abt misunderstood love. Give her time to discover herself. A guy who slept with her mom is never a reasonable partner even if he loves her for eternity. but oh well~

Shigure indirectly caused Isuzu’s near death abuse by Akito. all in his attempts to free akito from the curse. I love how disgustingly selfish he is.  I remember his “ you mom told you to not interfere, kagura” in se03, ep3. shudder!!! if hiro never met haru that day & confessed to him, if kureno never noticed the maid! Still, he went & visited isuzu after her 4 moths imprisonment in the cat’s cage her hospitals discharge & recovery!

ngl... Shigure & Ren’s sexual tension is the biggest in furuba. Eww!

I’ll talk abt kureno & akito more in part 2. but I felt nothing watching kureno get stabbed lol. this is due to the trailer spoiling it & the ED having him happily in love -_-’.  bummer!.

I love tohru & kyo’s outfit in the ep cliff hanger. lol. Tohru really dressed up to confess.

Tohru read the room! Even if you magically forgotten how sickly & out of it he was in your room earlier, remember this: Kyo always have bad mood in the rain! Then again... he did hug her for the first time & called her by her name in the midst of a rainy storm. se01, e024. >_<!

[oldtestleper]

Ive been thinking and I will be frank here... I know y’all make a distinction between kal and vau based on narrative treatment n fuck idk maybe after all the shit with kal it’s enough just to see a banished prince antihero and say ‘this guy whose wards live in terror of his violence is abusive’ and to have the narrative go ‘yeah! he sure is!’ but tbh that distinction is just not at all a meaningful one for me bc I don’t think the narrative actually makes it successfully and when the narrative is saying ‘this guy is an abuser’ about Vau I don’t think that bears out any more meaningfully than it does when it points to kal and says ‘this guy’s a tough old soldier dad with a heart of gold’

like with kal it’s clear that kt was never intending to write an abusive character—that in fact the opposite is true. therefore while kal behaves in abusive, cruel, manipulative, and selfish ways, the narrative never acknowledges this as harmful or unjust, and therefore the harm is never addressed, kal never changes, and his victims never recover or receive justice.

whereas vau is like... obviously intended as a foil to kal. he’s the bad cop. he beat his cadets, he’s pragmatic to the point of being cold, he’s stuffed to the brim with over the top Evil tropes and obviously abusive in a way that the text is happy to recognize… basically when vau behaves in abusive cruel ways the narrative not only presents it as such but also sheds light on the harm he caused to his victims, which obviously it never comes within a hundred miles of doing for kal. but critically, despite this willingness of the narrative to actually portray and condemn his abusiveness, vau never faces true consequences for his actions. instead of anything like that, he (sort of) recognizes the harm he caused but won’t admit fault, justifying his actions on the basis of necessity and his own overtly abusive upbringing. ultimately the narrative forgives him solely on the basis of his recognition of his own cruelty, his emotional suffering over his cadets/professed love for them, and his arguably noble intentions. but the harm he caused is never addressed—really it hardly even acknowledges that the harm exists. vau’s cruelty and the fact of his abusive actions, sure, but the ongoing harm he is directly responsible for? don’t make me laugh!! anyone else remember actin’s entire arc?

exactly as with kal, vau never truly changes, his victims never recover or receive justice, and by the end the narrative is doing little so much as gently polishing what it thinks is glowing portrait of a morally gray character who was occasionally cruel or vicious but was redeemed in the end by his love for his sons.......... despite the narrative actively refusing to address the ongoing harm caused by both kal and vau and entirely without either of them having actually been redeemed in anyone’s mind but his own. sure maybe vau could have been a really valuable foil to kal IF the narrative were willing to understand kal as abusive and to understand that redemption requires more than just feeling really sad that you hurt somebody 🥺 but obviously it would never do either of those things, and ultimately vau fails to be significantly juxtaposed against Kal instead he just becomes a parallel figure who gets raked through shit a LITTLE more readily, who is more clumsily and stereotypically abusive and who is just as baselessly forgiven by the narrative.

[aimmyarrowshigh]

The romantic subplot definitely isn’t “Poe keeps awkwardly hitting on Rey,” it’s “Poe and Rey keep broaching and avoiding feelings for each other because they’re in the middle of a war and it’s not convenient to deal with it right now,” and it’s much less Han/Leia-bicker-ish than TROS, tbh [but I’m also reading it from an I’d-rather-die-than-see-r*ylo lens, which means, like, enjoying Poe and not just seeing him as “an obstacle to r*ylo, who therefore should be dead,” unlike J*nny N*cholson, who has been licking Kylo’s toes for months for some reason].

BUT it also involves a gross Jedi Mind Trick kiss, which is cruel given that their initial conversation one-on-one in canon is about how they’re “torture buddies” BECAUSE OF having their minds fucked with by the Force, so like, nty. (The other kiss, your classic “we’re kissing to hide our faces from our stormtrooper pursuers NO WHAT DO YOU MEAN WE’RE KISSING BECAUSE WE WANTED TO THAT’S AWFUL IT WAS ALL FOR THE REBELLION!” variety, was cute and better than Rey having to randomly kiss her abuser for LITERALLY NO COMPREHENSIBLE REASON, but w/e).

Poe was horrifically mischaracterized in TLJ, but Poe and Rey’s dynamic in the PD comic (to a lesser extent) and Spark of the Resistance (with actual intention, for a spoiler-free junior novel) set up for what DOTF was going to run with in terms of them having a sort of “we mutually enjoy the way the other’s face looks but it’s a WAR RIGHT NOW AND WE’RE BUSY LEAVE IT ALONE” way.

Poe is definitely the Leia, and deserved 5000% better than the bullshit racist spice runner retcon of his entire established life canon that got rammed onto him in TROS. If nothing else, at least DOTF didn’t try THAT hard to make him a Han Type and choose the most racist route to do it.

Also @cicaklah -- Kylo is 100% meant to be read as an incel alt-right school shooter in TFA, which like... I don’t understand how JJ straight-up saying “the First Order are meant to be neo-Nazis and their original concept name was the Neo-Empire and ‘First Order’ is an allusion to ‘Third Reich’” still hasn’t gotten through to some people that Kylo is MEANT to be “all of the things to fear in the late ‘00s, politically, following on SW’s grand tradition of the baddies being an overt political metaphor.” And I’ll never understand why TLJ was allowed to redirect his characterization, and therefore those of the actual three main characters in response, so much.* Especially when at the time it was filming, DOTF -- in which he dies an unredeemed genocidal warlord, natch! -- was the working trilogy closer.

* There is no narrative, or character, reason in the actual text of TLJ for Rey to be seeking ANYONE’S approval so badly that she falls victim to Kylo’s gaslighting as quickly and completely as she does. Like, so what if Luke is grouchy and won’t teach her? That’s just every adult on Jakku when Rey was shadowing them to learn how to stay alive. TFA!Rey didn’t seek out Luke to earn approval, and it makes no sense that just “Luke doesn’t seem to like and trust me :(” would be enough for her to forgive Kylo for killing Han and maiming Finn (and mind-raping her). In what world does a Campbellian monomyth introduce the Mysterious Cagey Superior Who Seizes Power Out Of Nowhere And Refuse To Show Respect To Our Known Hero and NOT have her be the spy our known-quantity hero is afraid of? And what kind of fucking hack misogynist creates a female antihero whose entire purpose is to kill herself so a dude learns a lesson (THAT HE ALREADY FUCKING KNEW)??

NEW STAR WARS: EPISODE IX LEAKED CONCEPT ART   REVEALS THE PLOT OF THE ORIGINAL SCRIPT TITLED DUEL OF THE FATES 

For instance, Rose (Kelly Marie Tran) gets to go on an actual mission with Finn, C-3PO and R2-D2 to the key Star Wars location of Coruscant and Palpatine wasn’t brought back to life.

Instead, the Sith Lord appears only as a hologram on Mustafar to Kylo Ren and hasn’t been scheming away for decades building his own fleet of planet-destroying ships..

Duel of the Fates certainly sounds as though it would have been more faithful to The Last Jedi’s reveals. Most notably, Rey’s parents remained nobodies and it was Kylo Ren who killed them, on the orders of Snoke.

The death of Kylo Ren in The Rise of Skywalker has angered fans and he dies in Duel of the Fates too, only this version of Episode IX wouldn’t have redeemed him.

Instead, his whole storyline involves him seeking out that Sith Holocron on Mustafar (much like The Rise of Skywalker). The Holocron then explodes burning up Kylo Ren whose face infuses with his mask. The Holocron leads him to Tor Valum, a secret Sith master who trained Palpatine. Kylo is been haunted by Luke’s Skywalker force ghost.

Kylo Ren trains under Tor Valum, broods a lot and then goes off to one final battle with Rey. Various Force ghosts try to redeem him and fail, so Kylo Ren dies as Kylo Ren and not Ben Solo.

The final battle would have seen the Force ghosts of Luke Skywalker, Obi-Wan Kenobi and Yoda help Rey to defeat Kylo Ren, and the concept art shows Leia with BB-8 in a direct echo of Leia with R2-D2 in A New Hope, as well as Rey copying Luke’s Return of the Jedi look.