#let's face it he wants to legalize gay marriage bc he specifically wants get married

[mynameisbillandimaheadcase]

Cw: political rant (?)

[phregnancy]

I'm the anon that sent the ask that inspired the heteronormativity rant and I just wanted to say that I agree with EVERYTHING you said. It's like you read my mind lol. I do think there's definitely something to the idea that you can tell who is familiar with queer culture and who isn't by how they perceive dnp and their relationship. I'm glad you said that open relationships are more common in mlm relationships. I got hate for saying that during the WAD era lol. It's really not a jump to say that dnp might be ENM when one half of the relationship spent 2 years constantly talking about hooking up with other men, but for some reason anything other than a total dismissal was considered homophobic.

You're so right about Dan's femininity being exaggerated. I never understood where this perception of Dan as particularly feminine comes from. He's not lol. I really think it's just that he has a pretty face and some phannies like to project femininity onto him. either bc they want to relate to him or bc they think femboys are hot.

Yes!! They are totally brat×brat. Their relationship is a game of cat and mouse and who is who changes all the time.

While we're talking about heteronormativity, let's also talk about people's insistence on dnp getting married and having kids. Dan even talked about this in Dystopia Daily. How as soon as they got a house people were like "Ok great. Now get a dog and get married". I think that this is what Dan meant when he asked us not to get mad when their reality doesn't fit our fantasies. Like they might not want to get married. They might have sex with other people sometimes. They might not be as cutesy as we imagine or fit the roles that we think they should have. This new era seems to be about breaking down the misconceptions we have of them and their relationship before they open the door and I think that will probably continue at TIT.

rant

adding a few links to studies and articles about the prevalence of ENM in healthy mlm relationships because some people are just unaware - one + two + three + four

as for dan’s femininity being exaggerated, he definitely has embraced the more feminine sides of himself in recent years but i cannot emphasize enough how that barely scratches the surface of what’s considered feminine in queer culture, specifically gay man culture. and dan from a decade ago? 2014 swaggy dan in his snapbacks and graphic tees was not feminine, he was a geek chic nerd boy. the majority of the ultra feminine dan narrative in the early years was projection.

i’m going on another tangent under the cut

i love phwedding hill mostly because i think weddings are a fun party that celebrates love and just in general i love an event, but i don’t think marriage is something they realistically have on their radar or necessarily desire or require at all - which is really okay and common in queer relationships. it wasn’t legal for us to marry our partners for a very long time so our concepts of long lasting commitment and love is different from that of het couples. choosing not to get married doesn’t mean the relationship is any less serious or committed than that of a married couple.

they’ve lived together for 14 years, likely have been dating for the whole 15, a ring and a party will not change the day to day of their relationship in any meaningful way or change what they mean to each other. heteronormativity plays a part but it’s also a cultural leaning towards traditionalism. you’ve been together for an ‘appropriate’ amount of time, you bought a house together and share a mortgage, now it’s time to get engaged and after an ‘appropriate’ amount of time get married, then have children, raise children, etc. and that’s not them, not once in their entire 15 years of being in the public eye have they followed tradition - so why would they start now?

there’s been an argument i’d seen floating around saying that the reason why they’re not married is because of dan’s commitment issues but i disagree. even if for some reason fear of commitment was dan’s motivator for not getting married, phil wasn’t raised with traditionalist values and that would also play a role in not feeling a need to get married. martyn and cornelia have been together for over a decade and have a child together, and they’re still not married. the lesters have never portrayed themselves as ones for conformity and traditionalism.

getting off topic again but i think that one part of the issue with only experiencing queer culture through social media is that it’s very very easy to get sucked into queer traditionalist echo chambers when you haven’t unlearned traditionalist heteronormative values, and think that is the set expectation for queer relationships (and tbh all relationships in general). there are a few lesbian couple influencers that i actually despise because they have commoditized their traditionalist relationships and turned them into something scary and surreal, like over the course of three years both of these couples went from home ownership to engagement to marriage to baby #1 then baby #2 which is an arguably unhealthily fast progression of these things, filmed and set up in a way that’s like their relationships are a show and we need to keep watching for the next season of traditionalist marriages. and if you don’t have experience with queer communities outside of the internet (and i specify queer here because our communities most commonly have nontraditional relationships), it’s very easy to see a couple of accounts like that and feel reaffirmed in your expectations that all relationships have to be like this.

i really hope they continue to share more of their lives with us and that they live their truths as happily and comfortably as they can, and i hope that we as a community can unlearn the values that are doing nothing but hurting us and each other.

[astralastrid]

USUK/UKUS survey by @americapersonified

Tagged by @hariible so here we go!

In what decade did they officially become involved?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

The fics have ruined me. So I'd probably say during or after WWII. Plus that's when the "Special Relationship" was coined.

Who tops? (USUK or UKUS?)

*Looks at the UKUS server I made* idk you tell me

Honestly though Arthur probably has more relationship experience, so he's more confident and willing to take the lead. Alfred is actually secretly shy and modest about this stuff! (I mean, I do think we Americans are more conservative and modest when it comes to romance?) Plus like, Alfred finally feels like he can trust someone and let them take care of him, that he's loved when the whole world mocks him... Whoops got a little angsty there

Was either of them a virgin before their first hookup?

It's time for me to unveil my demi!America headcanon that's just me projecting aw yeah

Alfred is. He actually thought he was ace before he met Arthur because he was never interested in that kind of stuff, preferring to cuddle instead. But once he met Arthur he trusted that he'd take care of him and stuff and wanted to try it.

If not, to whom did each lose his virginity?

Alfred to Arthur.

Arthur to? Idk Francis probably? I do see FrUk as like, a past thing. Along with SpUk and PortEng. So one of them probably.

(Read more bc LONG post)

Are they more patient with each other in private, or do they bicker/tease each other all the time?

Haha projection time 2.0

Bro, like, a good relationship should have teasing anyway (unless your partner isn't ok with it!) so definitely. But Alfred actually gets self-conscious about the things that Arthur teases him about so he has to stop and tell him how much he loves him and stuff. But in general they're more patient because they've come to understand each other and love the other's quirks.

Will they ever get married?

Yeah but after a while. Alfred wants to do it right away but Arthur rejects him, saying that the don't need rings to prove that they love each other. He promises he will eventually. I like to think after gay marriage legalized in the States they celebrated by getting married.

If so, where will the wedding be held? (Add other details if you wish.)

Hopeless romantic Ame time!

Can you have more than one ceremony? No? Oh well. Summer wedding in America, Fall Wedding in England. I don't know much about wedding planning but I read a headcanon that was like "their vows were so beautiful it made everyone cry" and I support that. Both of them cry during the other's too. Lots of tears shed on both sides during everything. Lots of white and silver and gold because yeah. None of this stupid "one of them wears a dress" business. Like, it's ok for a relationship to be masc/masc and fem/fem like don't heteronormalize it. So two tuxes. Probably no "walking down the aisle?" Maybe they both come in from the sides idk. A cheer when they kiss. "Can't Help Falling in Love" by Elvis is their first dance. Arthur probably sings "I Wanna Hold Your Hand" after their first dance. Wedding cupcakes is galaxy brain so wedding cupcakes. Multiple flavors.

At whose house do they most often stay together?

Alfred's. It's larger anyway.

Do they refer to each other by their nation names or human names?

Human names. Nation only for business.

What pet names do they have for each other?

Arthur: Love, (The most common one) Darling, Dearest, Dear, Poppet (2nd most common) Alfie (extremely rare, or when drunk. Alfred adores when he calls him this though.)

Alfred: Babe, Baby, Artie, Art, Honey, Sweetie, Sweetiepie, Sweetheart, Sweetcheeks.

Who drives?

Both, Alfred loves to drive! But Arthur gets nervous because Alfred can drive like a New Yorker, (that is, aggressively, quickly, a bit dangerously, lots of honking from him and others) especially when he's in a rush or late, and god help everyone when he has road rage.

So Arthur judges the mood and insits if he knows Alfred is probably gonna drive like that.

Is Alfred good at making Arthur’s tea?

Dude of course. It's never quite perfect of course, but you don't date someone for decades without learning how to make their lifeline. In this vein Arthur also knows how to make Alfred's coffee. (And since this isn't a question, Alfred likes it blacker than black in the mornings, and all sugared and creamered up after work and in the evenings.)

It’s universally accepted that Arthur sucks at cooking. Does Alfred enjoy cooking? Is he good at it? Or does he usually stick to McDonald’s and fast food?

Ok yeah but I headcanon Arthur can bake, like really well. Ok yeah I know about his scones but maybe he's just bad at making those specifically.

Alfred loves to cook. He loves to grill even more. But he likes to experiment and try new stuff and he's damn good at it (because cooking is just another science!) So his meals are like comfort food. Almost restaurant quality. Boy could be a chef. But he also loves his fast food and instants. (Kraft's Mac and Cheese is so good.) And yeah he loves Mickey D's but have y'all ever been to like, Noodles and Company or Sonic? Like, there are some GOOD fast food joints and I'm sure he loves them all. Arthur probably doesn't like burger joints but does like places like Panera.

Do they shower together? (Often; not specifically for sex.)

Sometimes? Idk man it's hard as shit to wash your back so yeah? Also the tenderness of giving your lover a bath? I'm🥺🥺🥺🥺🥺

Who smells better? (In your opinion.)

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

People just smell like, people, and to the other they each smell like home.

How vocal are they in bed?

Alfred’s so LOUD lmao. But Arthur loves it. If he was more of a memelord he'd record and make a remix of his sounds.

Who has the more active libido?

Definitely Arthur.

Is spending time together easy, or are they forced apart for long periods at a time?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I don't know how politics work? Do important government officials have to be there in person for meetings?

Let's have two senarios here:

Let's say they do, and they have to be apart for periods of time. Both the boys have separation anxiety and HATE being apart, so there's always the fear and the paronia and concern when they are apart, and they have almost daily video chats. It's really hard on both of them. They text and call often too. They miss the other dearly. When they reunite they kiss and cuddle like they need it to survive. They're much more affectionate with each other and spend every moment they can together to "recharge" before the "hyper-affectioness" goes down. Leaving is super difficult. Lots of tears and hugs, promises to be back asap, longful stares and apologies. Cursing their job and such. Desire to quit or face the consequences and just stay. (Which is completely blocked by the other.)

Let's say somehow they work something out and they can spend long amounts of time together with minimal travel. Sometimes they get into fights or just get on each other's nerves or just need some alone time. Alfred will go run or excercise while Arthur goes to a café until they're ready to make up/miss and want to see the other. Business trips help keep tensions low, but they're still painful.

Are they wealthy? Or do they live modestly?

I’d say like average people. Arthur probably likes it a bit more tasteful and stylish though, so little hints of wealth. Also, Arthur basically has a library for his book collection that acts as his study and Alfred has his own study and a gaming room. They have the prettiest garden you ever did see though. And a really nice patio. With a nice backyard and grill.

For Alfred specifically: Glasses on or glasses off?

On! Except in the bedroom.

How often do they break up?

Rarely if at all. They probably did once and missed the other so badly that they promised never to do it again, and always talk it out. Sure they get into fights and one of them will storm off, but they both understand that that usually means the other needs to cool down before they can talk.

Open relationship?

No.

Did Arthur actually care for Alfred before the American Revolution?

I really want to say yes, because of how it was portrayed, but honestly? I don't think the U.S. was any different from England's other colonies. He'd occasionally check up on all of them, but he was super surprised at how fast America grew.

Of course once the war happens he's riddled with regret. Maybe if he treated him better this wouldn't have happened. War with a colony for their independence is ugly anyway. Even after the war, I don't think England was as heartbroken as it was portrayed. I think he was depressed about it for a while, but eventually got over it. It still took him, like any colonizer, a while to see him as an equal though, which infuriated America. However they are both completely over it and don't talk much about it anymore. It's all in the past for them.

@milopottz (I know we don't interact but 👀)

Tag people if you want, so

Also @alifeasvivid and @anyone who wants to

[oddcoupler222]

okay, you literally asked for another longass post:

So, Madelyn is the oldest daughter to a gay head of state, and even though she's Sansa's biological daughter, her personality is so Margaery that it is almost frightening. She's Marg -- but even more outspoken and sometimes less diplomatic, because she has no designs on politics, so speaking her mind is somewhat of her status quo

Growing up, she wasn't the most popular. She wasn't *un*popular, either; she's wealthy, pretty, smart, and outgoing. but her mothers being who they are meant that anyone who has an issue with them in anyway didn't care for them, people have routinely thought that she gets it easier in life, and she's always sort of weary for people who want to get to know her and use her for who her moms are (it has happened. more than once.)

Anyway. So, coming out as bi was somewhat difficult for her, BECAUSE of Sansa and Margaery. Not because she was ashamed or anything, but because for the people who opposed Marg, a big part of them being against the Gays, you know, was about like, making children gay and being deviant and stuff. So, she didn't want to "prove" them right in any way. But regardless, her coming out was somewhat of a spectacle to the public. In college, she was dating a girl, who ended up making it public without her permission, and it was all over the media (this is somewhat of a side note into Ellie and Amelia's story. As in, Ellie kissed Amelia shortly after this happened, and worrying about Ellie having to face a public fallout the way she was watching Madelyn do was a factor into her gently turning her down)

So, anyway. What doesn't kill us makes us stronger, and Madelyn squared her shoulders and did the interviews and whatnot about her sexuality. But her walls went up more than a bit after that

She graduated from college and then law school, and unlike Ellie, who left King's Landing asap, Madelyn does love it there, and stays there and close to the moms as she makes a life for herself, working her way up at a prestigious law firm -- Madelyn puts a LOT of expectation on herself. Part of "I'm Margaery Tyrell's daughter" and a need to project herself as perfectly and put together as possible

That expectation also comes into her love life. Because she wants to settle down and to find her person, and sees her parents as like the golden standard to aspire to

So... her Future Love of Her Life comes into play also years earlier than they get together. At her firm, which she joins when she's 24 and already a boss ass bitch, there's a guy a couple years older than she is, who ends up being her nemesis at work. Olivar Florent, who - if able to vote when Marg was PM - wouldn't have voted for her. He’s an entitled jackass, who often talks shit about Madelyn and has like a complex about her. He also makes comments about her sexuality and believes she gets things easier because of her who mom is (when, a lot of the time, it has meant she's had to work twice as hard, esp at this job). They also are always competing for the same promotions and cases

When Madelyn first meets him, he's married to Emma, who is a couple years older than Madelyn as well, and is a decent enough presence around the office. Not that the two of them ever get along, really. She's not a Jackass like Olivar is, but she's married to him, which makes Madelyn already weary of her. Though, she sends baked goods to the office and is always at the office parties and whatnot. Even though - as Amelia will tease her over the years - Emma is physically her office crush (because she is Gorgeous and quietly witty), their only interactions over the years are short, often tense/charged conversations and she somewhat feels that Emma has something against her (which she assumes is the same shit that Olivar does)

Cut to Madelyn, age 35. She's been at the firm for 11 years, is kicking ass at work. She has the best moms in the world (her own words), a sister and a best friend who are together and who she loves both enough to kill for, and a baby niece. And... she's lonely af. As Sansa's daughter, she has a romantic soul, which led her into several romantic pursuits, and always ends up getting her heart broken. The last one of these had almost led to an engagement, but that got called off by the woman in question, who went on a diatribe about Madelyn somehow being Too Much but also Not Enough, and even though it was a couple of years ago, she's sort of soured on this whole trying to open her heart kind of thing

Now, on the other side of matters - about a year or two ago, Olivar got caught out cheating on Emma, and they separated. It was a huge thing for office gossip, and ever since then, of course, Emma hasn't been around the office. The one thing about Olivar that Madelyn DOES like, is his daughter. Alyssa, who's 13 and precocious af. And whenever he has the day with her, he usually ends up working and having her sit around in the office (because he's a shitty dad), and Madelyn always lets her sit in her office (where she has some Cool Stuff, knick knacks and stuff, and she talks to her like "an adult" - not like actually bringing up Grown Up topics, but, you know - and orders her lunch and stuff).

Their story would begin as such - Madelyn is coming into her office, and who is standing there but... Emma.

And she's confused, like... "I know it's been a while since you've been around here, but, Olivar's office is still a floor down from here." And Emma takes a deep breath and gathers her strength and, "I know. But I came to see you." Madelyn's eyes narrow and she's intrigued, and gives her a questioning look. Emma looks nervous, which - she's known her/seen her around for a decade, and she's never seen her fidget or look anything other than calm, so it’s strange with her all like, "I'm sorry I don't have an appointment. I... I just. I was wondering if we could talk." and she looks around the office, still nervous. So Madelyn nods and lets her in and is all, "I'm aware we don't know one another all that well. But, are you all right?" Emma blurts out that she wants to hire Madelyn as her divorce lawyer.

Madelyn is SHOCKED, because well, they've hardly spoken and never gotten along all that well when they have aside from a handful of surprising moments over the years (including one very memorable time in which they were caught under mistletoe at an office holiday party and Madelyn laughed it off, rolling her eyes at her somewhat drunk coworkers, but Emma had been -- just staring at her. Her mouth, specifically. Madelyn had tentatively put her hand on her elbow to murmur to ignore everyone, and it had jolted Emma out of her stare. And basically had her avoiding the office for a few months).

Plus, "You two aren't divorced?" Because they've been separated for almost 2 years now, as far as she knows. And Emma is biting at the inside of her cheek, because she has trouble being super open with a lot of people, especially after having been in a marriage with someone who is domineering and rude and loud and controlling. But she sighs and confesses that Olivar has been fighting against actually getting a divorce ever since she moved out, and has been doing everything in his disposal to stop her from proceeding, and she is sick of it. BUT Olivar has a lot of money (she was a stay at home wife/mother, before), he comes from a prestigious family, and has a LOT of legal/political connections, and he isn’t afraid to make threats about custody or lord anything over her head, so it's been a very difficult time for her

Madelyn is still surprised, and is all, "Why me?" Bc over the years, Emma would have basically known everyone at the lawfirm. But Emma tells her that she knows she's at least as good of a lawyer, if not better, than Olivar is, because of the amount of issues she'd caused him. And she knows she is outspoken and not afraid to lay a smack down when needed (paraphrasing), and... she bites her lip but has a gleam in her eye that Madelyn enjoys when she says that she knows Madelyn wouldn't be afraid to take a case that is going against Olivar, because she knows how much she dislikes him and how much they don't get along. And Madelyn takes it in, nodding, because, Emma's not wrong. Plus, she can imagine the look on Olivar's face when he finds out, and - yeah, she likes that

And thus, a deal is struck.

They start meeting up after that - out of the office, at Madelyn's suggestion, because the less Olivar sees them and could find out about what they talk about/their plans, the better. So, they start meeting up and getting coffees at the cafe that Emma is working in (which she is embarrassed about, explaining to Madelyn on one of her breaks, after being somewhat standoffish, because she's a 37 year old woman who spent the majority of her adult life relying on her husband to pay for everything and now she's worried and struggling. Emma and Olivar met when they were in college, and even though she graduated with an art history degree, she has never done anything with it/has little experience because of him not wanting her to work, and they got married at like 23).

Madelyn takes it all in, Emma’s flushed cheeks and mutterings about calling herself an idiot for being in that situation, her fidgeting - before she slides her hand across the table and onto Emma’s. Which makes her cheeks darken and she stares down at Madelyn’s hand on hers, before looking up at her while Madelyn tells her that anyone could have gotten swept up when they were young and being trapped in a bad situation isn’t her fault. And that her aunt worked in a cafe for a long while in her adult years, and that she admires her work ethic. Before she realizes - okay, maybe Emma had in the past had a discomfort about her sexuality, and she drops her hand.

Spurring Emma into action and she tries to talk about paying Madelyn, laying out a financial plan (because she knows that there is no way Madelyn doesn't make a ton of money from her clients, since she remembers how much Olivar makes), Madelyn tells her to pay her in coffee, unable to hold back a little wink

So, they start to bond over the next couple of months, learning about one another, bit by bit. Madelyn brings her work out of the office sometimes when she doesn’t have to, setting up shop in the coffee shop. Talking on her breaks. They end up catching the end of a documentary that’s airing on a television in the cafe one day, one made about Margaery and thus features Madelyn heavily, and Madelyn surprises herself by sighing at it. Emma watching her carefully and saying that Madelyn made all of it, with all of the pressure, look very easy, and Madelyn pushes through a smile and they talk. Emma opens up a bit about how the few days Olivar does get to have Alyssa, she worries about her, and that they are typically the days she goes to see her mother in the care facility she is in, as she has dementia, and it’s just... a lot.

Emma is still a bit reserved around Madelyn, though she doesn't know exactly why. The moments where they share smiles and then Emma will clear her throat and look away or suddenly need to get back to doing something at that given moment. This only kind of changes over a month in, when they are meeting at Emma's apartment for the first time, and Alyssa is there and sees Madelyn and gets super excited and they talk a bit about what's going on for her school project. And Emma is ?? confused... until Alyssa shrugs it off and tells her that she hangs out in Madelyn's office whenever she's had to go to Olivar's work, basically for years, even when they were married.

But that sort of really starts breaking through the reserve she has remaining, because Madelyn is just almost maddeningly lovely. It’s a bit scary

Olivar comes to drop something off (and rage about the divorce papers he's just been served, which had been why Madelyn had stopped by to drop off a “celebratory gift” for the papers being served -- she kind of already has this actual crush going on), and sees Madelyn there, which only makes him more pissed. And then ANGRIER when Alyssa purposefully implies that Madelyn and Emma are a little something-something more

Madelyn goes along with it at the time, because, well, she hates the man and it’s so very far from the worst thing she could imagine... but when Olivar leaves, she apologizes. Especially because she has always thought her sexuality/her moms has played into Emma's reservedness around her

But Emma is sort of frozen and blushing and eventually admits that it's okay (and now... gods, she has Thoughts).

But that sparked a Thing, and now around the office, it's going around the Madelyn is not only defending Emma against Olivar in their divorce, but also that they are dating. Which she keeps up as a facade, even though she knows she SHOULDN'T. This, of course, leads to a Fake Kiss That Feels Real, of course, and then after that is when Emma admits that she isn't exactly straight, which was a very confusing revelation for her, which also caused a big thing between her and Olivar and is something he has threatened to use against her in the divorce if she ever went through with it. (and she admits that a part of why she'd always been so distant toward Madelyn is because she was always SO unapologetically herself and outspoken about who she was and about supporting her moms and Emma (especially when she and Madelyn first met) was intimidated by that, and tbh pretty nervous because she was (and is) attracted to Madelyn, like everything about her) [also, she might have secretly had the magazine article from when Madelyn came out when she was in college for a long time, because it was like a celeb-fantasy-crush, when she was first feeling like she might not have been straight]

They get even closer, like... Madelyn doesn’t even know. Almost dating? Sort of? They’ve had some more moments since the kiss, and she knows without a doubt how much she wants Emma. Emma meets Sansa and Marg, and winds up getting a job at a museum that Sansa gets her an interview at. Emma is thrilled that Alyssa and Madelyn are so close and also admits that a lot of what had put her off of Madelyn, aside from her sexuality and everything I already said, was that Olivar would often say things about her that were entirely unflattering, but she sees now that they were all super untrue and that Madelyn is actually... pretty dreamy. Featuring a lovely moment wherein Olivar sees Madelyn and Alyssa and Emma at one of the office parties (because Madelyn told them to come as they were "dating" in the eyes of everyone else at the office), and when he makes a threat to Emma about taking away custody, about her being gay, about all of the connections he has, Madelyn stepping in and being like, "You think you have connections? I'd like to see you even try. Actually, I would love it. Really."

Which... Emma is... well how can she even try to resist that? (she cant)

And when they go home from that night, they sleep together, and thus, the lines get blurred and it feels so thrilling but so messy. Madelyn starts worrying about not being good for them and that she is really overstepping in their lives, plus she starts to have some trouble at the firm (because Olivar has one of the partners essentially tied around his finger) and this is causing "unnecessary tension" and when Emma finds that out, she doesn't want to complicate Madelyn's life and decides that they shouldn't be doing this

Which cues a few lonely weeks, as the divorce really sets in motion, and Madelyn has a chat with Margaery about living up to expectation and being perfect. She misses Emma and Alyssa - who also miss her quite a bit.

But then in the end, Madelyn quits her job and goes to another firm that has been after her for years. Slightly less prestigious, but better - morally - and she goes to represent Emma, who is shocked that she came, given how their big fight went when she fired her. And then, naturally, comes the big confessions of actual feelings, and Madelyn might have felt like she is either too much or never enough and that she needs to be perfect, but she really is pretty perfect for this little family