#i talk abt otto a lot bc im biased but its not all about him

[nonbinarylesbianherb]

okay im gonna put this here as well in tags lowkey just skip to the end bit bc i have diagnosed yapper and i do in fact yap-

i did a few points cuz some of them r from s1 and my memory is not good so it can like count as one LOL. They’re all older rhaenicent because we’re talking abt older alicent / s2 writing of her, so im assuming we’re talking abt older rhaenicent. I do think older rhaenicent is a much more flawed ship than younger rhaenicent

1. I can’t remember specifically what it was but it may have been something to do with delaying the war- when Rhaenyra was given a torn page from Otto (one Alicent had kept) and agreed to not do something (its been a while since I saw s1 bear with me lmaoo)

2. When Alicent asked rhaenyra if she could come back (this was like after the dinner with everyone yk the one) and rhaenyra said okay (well it was more than that but okay was the gist)

3. When she wanted to go talk with Alicent and Mysaria was like brother, it would be easier to kill her damn- (Alicent has also been like aye let’s not kill rhaenyra actually)

and i agree with you! there should have just been- aye ill make aegon my heir we good-(obviously its too late for that now I think after everything that has happened) now i dont think id describe alicent as ‘happily’ giving over her sons, but i was also upset with how they did things and why she couldn’t at least leave with both helaena and aegon and their kid. i mean yea there were many options she couldve thought about first or something, i mean we haven’t even had a scene with her and aegon in ages (maybe she was going to go back to kl and talk to him, obviously atp he’s left but she doesn’t know that, but idk where they were going w it)

and you’re correct that both the show (and fandom tbh) are quick to jump Alicent’s flaws and shame her for them, but when they do eventually notice Rhaenyra’s flaws (and she has many as well) it’s seen more as “empowering” or smt that she is a flawed woman and that’s good representation etc- and it is upsetting to see the change with how they treat both characters. I do love both alicent and nyra (i mean i wont lie and say its fully equal, i am much more biased towards alicent) cuz people will blame Alicent for her flaws and mock or shame her, whilst rhaenyra they’ll say it wasn’t her fault or she’ll be empowered because of it. Now from what I’ve seen in the HOTD fandom i can say Alicent faces much more vitriol (and honestly just plain misogyny and victim blaming) than rhaenyra- and it IS unfair and annoying and upsetting to see the difference. (not that I want rhaenyra to face misogyny or victim blaming- and she has before! but by the fandom not as much as alicent- i mean like both of them have their flaws and actions recognised without one being “good” and the other being “bad”)

I think a lot of scenes esp w s2 I’ve actually seen the fandom upset at rhaenyra, esp the sept scene people were upset at her and saying she was stupid/bad and it made her look bad etc. And hey Alicent has more redeeming qualities than just loving and protecting her kids 😔 but i agree it was a quality that in s2 the writing for her character just became odd and contradictory and yea,,, rough. (i mean hey if they ever make her fully hate her kids ill be upset for her behalf and angry at the writers but they could never make me hate you alicent hightower no matter how hard they butcher your writing/character 🫡)

I understand your anger and I have felt a lot of it myself with how they’ve written and done things. -

Now I don’t think you’ll change your opinion on rhaenicent or stop hating the ship (which is fine because it is your opinion and you have rights LOL) in the same way I won’t change my opinion on rhaenicent/ or stop loving them- and this conversation may continue to drag on forever 😭 i can recognise why you hate rhaenicent and i hope you can recognise that rhaenicent (more specifically young rhaenicent, but rhaenicent all the same- in the same way i connect and am attached more deeply to young alicent but alicent all the same.) is important to me on many levels. At the end of the day we both love alicent and are upset with s2 writing of her!

I need Rhaenicent shippers to stay away from the Alicent Hightower tag, you never liked her, you're salivating over the fact she abandoned her own CHILDREN, you're praising the writers for robbing her of agency and personality, you got what you wanted a useless prop who exists solely to make Rhaenyra look good.

You won, now stay away from Alicent Hightower fans we do not want to see your bs!

[laffyraffy]

Disorganized thoughts on No Way Home below the cut.

So, first of all: I loved it.

It's the first MCU Spider-Man film to really feel like a Spidey film, which honestly filled me with way more emotions than I thought it would. Tom's Peter showing so much empathy for the other Spideys' villains went a long way to achieving that. All of the previous Spider-Man films went a long way to humanize the villains and really drive home that these were people who had one bad day. MCU Spider-Man films never. . . Really did that. They didn't go out of their way to completely demonize Vulture or Mysterio, but they didn't go out of their way to make you really feel for them, you know?

Peter defending the bad guys against Strange was so. . . Idk man, that hit hard. Strange was more concerned with fixing the multiverse - which, fair - but Peter was the one to say, "hold on, we can do something, we can help them," which is what Spider-Man is all about! That moment when Otto - on the verge of tears - whispered, "it's quiet, I forgot what that felt like," when Peter installed the new inhibitor chip? Chills.

That being said, I do think it was REALLY WEIRD for Aunt May to encourage Peter to basically "fix" Norman and the others. Like, Peter was right when he said they weren't his responsibility. It was his (and Strange's) responsibility to send them home, sure, but everything else he did was above and beyond. While Peter's empathy is his greatest strength, it's also his greatest weakness because he tends to take on too much.

It's basically one of the reasons I dislike MCU Spider-Man movies so much: every adult in Peter's life act like he isn't still a kid, and it's always bothered the hell out of me. The other movies didn't have this issue because either A) Peter was an adult, or B) no one knew Peter's secret. (Or both.)

I don't think Aunt May should have tried to like, stop him from helping them, or anything like that, but I think maybe their rolls should have been reversed: she should have been reluctant to allow Peter to take on so much responsibility, and Peter should have been the one saying, "I need to help them," from the start. Then Aunt May would be swayed by his optimism and empathy, and agree to help him. It wouldn't have changed the story any. In fact, it would have given even more weight to her last words, when she told Peter he did the right thing.

I also don't know how to feel about May's death. On one hand: it's feels like a lazy subversion of the usual Uncle Ben death. Every damn Spider-Man movie has someone Peter knows/loves die, and it's. . . more than a little predictable, at this point. On the other hand, I do think it was well-done. Peter crouched over her body, begging her to wake up was heartbreaking, especially because she was murdered by someone they were trying to help.

Toby and Andrew were fucking amazing. Everything about all the Peters interacting was everything I wanted: the sincere opening up about all the loss they've all experienced, the goofy jokes, Andrew and Tom being kinda grossed out but fascinated by Toby's organic webs - it was all so wonderful to watch. I could watch an entire movie with just the three of them goofing off and getting up to Spidey hijinks.

Willem and Alfred repeating their famous meme-y lines was such nostalgia bait but my god did I LOVE it. When Otto was holding the arc reactor and said the line AGAIN I kinda wanted to cry because holy shit - Tony really did what Otto was trying to do, and Otto got to see it. (My friend asked me if he was still holding the arc reactor when he went back to his universe and I honestly don't remember? I kinda hope he was TBH, he deserves to be able to reverse-engineer it.)

Seeing five of the Sinister Six was also just - amazing. I really only went into this movie caring about seeing Alfred reprise his role as Doc Ock but literally everyone did such a wonderful job. Willem and Jamie especially were great. Full disclosure: it's been a looong time since I've seen Amazing Spider-Man 2, so I don't remember much about Max, but I genuinely gave a shit about him in this movie.

Peter having a clean slate due to everyone forgetting him is another thing I'm kinda conflicted about. I love it because it really brings MCU Spidey back to his roots: a little guy with great powers who uses them to help other little guys. I also kinda roll my eyes because it feels like they just REALLY wanted to get away from Tom's Peter being Iron Man Jr. in the most drastic way possible.

Also Otto saying, "you're all grown up," to Tobey's Spidey was so 💖😭💖😍 - I literally can't even describe what I felt into words, emojis will have to do. I want fic of Otto mentoring Peter and I want it NOW! Dadtavious is everything I didn't know I wanted until I started seeing fanart for it after the trailers dropped.

Tobey being the one to keep Tom from murdering Norman was so, so, SO good. Norman almost killed Tobey's Aunt May so it was so much more meaningful than if literally anyone else had been the one to stop him. And don't even get me STARTED on Andrew saving MJ from falling the way he couldn't save Gwen. That was something literally everyone saw coming but my GOD that didn't make it any less cathartic. The way MJ asked if he was good and he - with tears in his eyes - said, "yeah" was mmMMMMM good SHIT!!

Overall, though? This is one of the best MCU films they've ever made. It makes me hopeful for future Spider-Man films, which is saying something considering I don't like either of the MCU Spidey films.

I wanna say more but it's 1am, I'm tired, and I have a long shift tomorrow (and the day after that, and the day after that), so I'm going to stop here before I start devolving into utter nonsense.