#i also don't know anything about the cthulhu or nyarlathotep lore so this was just for funsies

[asacolyte]

i have a Kayne headcanon that is quickly taking over my brain so i must scream.

so you know when people say "i'm putting on my best suit" or "dressing to impress" to indicate or imply that they're going to be fancy - wear a bespoke suit, maybe some nice cologne, a fit that places them in a higher state of mind. well Kayne <3 this is similar for him, but also wildly different. his "best suit" is, at its core, the purest, starkest white you have ever seen - neck to shoe soles (now now, i know he's typically depicted as barefoot, bear with me). this suit means the world to him, well, several worlds, actually.

it happened accidentally... or did it? nothing is random, and living in all pasts and futures and walls gets a bit tiring. any sense of reality was lost somewhere between shaking hands with a t-rex and the discovery of a thirteenth planet - something he's quite proud of, by the way. no matter the origins, it was something as brutal and striking as it was mawkish. entertaining and a good scare tactic conversation starter.

the first iteration - his Abel, if you will - was a bit lackluster. showman without a backbone, screamer without the trill that sent shivers down his spine, pinned beneath him. at least he was a bleeder, stab number 5 sending blood from his corotid directly to the inner breast pocket over his heart. fitting. all in all, he was killed in some multiple of 8 - control, authority, giving and receiving.

I feel like, for the most part, the next was generally tougher than the last. not quite a hive mind, but a transcendant wavelength of hyper awareness - or maybe the hunter's instinct to start low and work up.

"see this spot here? yes, the one that looks like a bomb exloded? funny that, considering i found him during hiroshima - you'll get there, Artie. or maybe you won't, i don't care. oh- look at this spatter that looks like an elephant's foot on my-!"

"that little bastard was so obsessed with red buttons, so i ground each and every one of mine into his brain matter. well of course he was alive. i couldn't pass up a good lobotomy, silly."

"number 3 had quite the hematocrit level. viscous little bitch. wanted to clot before he'd - sorry, they'd - stained the silk lining."

*drawing hearts on his thight* "that's my blood. see how it's just a twinge on the marbled side? like little cracks in reality <3 he fought so hard. shame i had to slit his throat. i was really having fun."

anyway. Kayne's favorite suit is white but you'd never know it because every fiber is soaked with his other version's blood. oh and he had trouble getting his shoes to cooperate, and only psychopaths liked the feeling of wet socks (come on, he's not that far gone), so he decided to go barefoot. added a sort of flare when he could feel his own parallel viscera between his toes

[doom-nerdo-666]

Random thoughts about Quake: Horror, Night Sentinels, "idverse", franchise resurrection etc

This is just a collection of thoughts related to Quake and if the series ever comes back (And other games like Doom, of course).

And here's an image just because i think one is enough.

A Shambler design by Alex Palma, which makes me wonder how many Quake fans would react to it (Specially compared to how many fans embraced the new aesthetic on Doom's demons).

Horror in Quake... and Doom.

There's the obvious notion that "Doom was always cartoony but Quake should be as gritty and hard as a NIN album". But because of some points:

Hell in Doom was always a mix of different themes, making it surreal and unpredictable (Or at least potentially that).

While D64 has a better atmosphere, it does feel thematically restricted, hence the colored lightning.

For better or worse, D3 demon designs were more experimental and stranger, partially because of the horror focus but even taking away the darker atmosphere and all, you could see how "horror in Doom" could mean stranger and experimental designs.

2016 felt like they had a sense of "nature/logic" because of the streamlined aesthetics of Hell and the recurring chittin demon anatomy (While cybernetic demons were made inventions of the UAC), which may in a way make its demons even "more alien" than D3's.

Eternal focuses more on variety of enemy designs and even Hell related environments, even if with lore that doesn't have a certain level of true weirdness (Specially with Immora).

Both Doom and Quake always had a mix of ideas, specially as fusions of fantasy and sci-fi (Even Quake has some Satanism and unlike Doom, had actual Jesus). But while Doom was colorfull, Quake was seen as "the mostly brown one" and i feel like it's because of the "materials" of the environments: Specially when Doom's Hell always had different materials to make it feel weird and suit the enemy variety in terms of visuals. Doom had rock, wood, marble, tech, flesh and whatever FIREBLU is supposed to be.

I think in a way, it's easier to see Quake concepts fit in Doom than the other way around (Hell, you could even make Doom take stuff from Heretic or Duke). Because Hell is seen as a representation of evil and certain concepts, that you think of it as something "intentional", like a very powerfull psychopath that can do anything and he knows it. So if some demons suddenly look "too eldritch", it's Hell knowing it would scare humans (Whether or not it means they're even aware of Quake's monsters). While Quake is influenced by Lovecraft and an aspect of those kind of themes is how humans cannot comprehend these outwordly monsters; Which could also mean "we're not even sure if they hate us or know we fear them".

In a way, this tends to be compared to how a human would look at a tiny bug and rarely question its own thoughts, if it has any. Quake monsters can be terrifying but in a way, they may have some "limits" that means they don't have certain things that Doom's Hell has. Even if Q1 expansions introduced a variety of designs and concepts that aren't that related to the Lovecraft aspect.

It's the same reason why other game genres, from horror games to JRPG's, tend to have creative designs for Hell and demons. AND we cannot forget artists from centuries ago like THE Hieronymus Bosch and others, who proved Hell can be more than meets the eye. It can range from "an evil entity that hates humans and wants them to know it with terrifying creatures" to "abstract beings whose appearences may have familiar ideas, as if they represent or mean something".

Meanwhile, Lovecraft stuff mainly comes from literature and there's only so much you can do with Cthulhu and Nyarlathotep before a Lovecraft fan complains you're "missing the point", so people tend to use those algorithms/AI/DeepDream based software things to generate "eldritch visuals" and maybe do the Zalgo thing with letters. Tentacles/eyes/mouths can be too obvious and overdone.

And obviously, Doom had different art style changes over the years and had a lot more fan content that "unofficially expanded the setting". While Quake has fan content like mods and art, it may not show a similar range for the setting's versatility. Then again, there's still the difference between "what Doom's Hell could be" and what it actually is. But if Doom's Hell seems limited, it's something you can blame it on specific design/lore decisions (Specially when you cherrypick certain designs or props to prove how crazy Hell can be).

But still, Doom's Hell always had a sense of versatility and Quake is notorious for having a different setting/identity change because of Q2; Even if it's kinda unfair how there's way more Strogg stuff. Nothing against the Strogg but QChampions feels like a reminder of how long it took Quake to acknowledge that section of itself.

Then again, maybe this view is skewed because Q1 expansions did add more material to Quake's "sandbox" and maybe a Quake 5 would either proof the setting's not as limited or at least break those potential limits.

Because Hell in later games had new features, while also having some sense of "rules" or even "restrictions" that weren't there.

And while Quake's expansions had new themes, some people may prefer if Doom still finds ways to expand Hell: Besides, if "Heaven" is actually Urdak, who knows if other mythological/religious concepts couldn't be interpretated differently.

Night Sentinel could've worked for Quake

Because Quake always had knights not just as enemies but even the Ranger, with his armor and axe, looked like a viking (Partially because of its rocky development when you look at its history).

I think Quake could have been perfect for these sci-fi knights with energy swords with written letters and giant robo mechs, but ended in Doom because it's the more popular series and both Doom and Quake have had their overlaps and crossovers.

One could even see how modern Doom games have things that can be traced back to Quake.

Quake remaster has a map for its Horde Mode called Frozen Court which looks like Doom Eternal TAG2's World Spear and it even has knight statues.

"When will Heretic/Blood/Turok/ROTT/etc get a new game?"

It's clear not every classic FPS series will have a new big game and it's not just because of reasons like trademark limbo.

Most of these games were defined by specific gameplay and engine features at their time/debuts, so you could tell that "X is like Y but with Z" and so on (Some titles are like sequels or spin-offs to each other but unofficially, because they're different IP's and sometimes from different studios).

And their settings either have little story/lore or have certain art directions based on their eras, specific influences, tech limitations, their production methods etc.

It's also because these old FPS franchises aren't that comparable to recurring franchises like Mario, Sonic, Final Fantasy, Street Fighter etc.

So if Heretic got a new game, it could have features that are either taken from another FPS classic or even new ones that could've suited the latter (It's as if these games are fighting for who gets to make a comeback but they end up eating each other).

These games would also be "modernized", be it from gameplay (Like a sort of upgrade system tree) or aesthetics (Imagine someone comparing Hexen to Diablo 3).

And some features wouldn't return, but most people don't mind that Eternal's Arch-vile has a different gameplay from its D2 counterpart (Because the "new" being good enough can make it up for the "old" not returning entirely).

But imagine what an Heretic Iron Lich could behave if its tornado attack had to be replaced.

And because Doom has features that can be traced to other games (Even its platforming feels like an extension to Turok's), it makes the "father of FPS" reach an ironic path where it takes from the exact games that it helped to exist.

(Never forget D3 RoE having its own version of Half-Life's Gravity Gun), but at least you can justify it as "the daddy of FPS doing tributes to its successors etc.

(And i guess "expanding Doom" can always come in the form of new gameplay features and not just lore/story).

Wolfenstein is somewhat lucky because its setting involves alt history WW2 and some modern-ish features.

Even then, it's not like id is making games just to see people port their features to the old games through mods or question if Doomguy has enough "material" to ever be a playable fighter in Smash.

Then you have new IP's or most indie "boomer shooters", that also have to compete for creativity and not just end up as "Eat Lead: The Return of Matt Hazard" but without self awareness.

Depending on how much Doom eats up Quake, i wonder if a new Doom could have a secret playable port of Quake like how Eternal has ports of 1 and 2 in the Fortress of Doom.

Either way, Blood deserves its source code released first before an actual new game that tries to be good, even if it's made in a time where Stephan Weyte might've passed away by then (We gotta be quick, then).

The "idverse"

Another way how people look at Quake is the crossover aspect, mostly thanks to Doomguy (Or rather "Doom") being in Q3 and new characters related to him like Crash and Phobos.

(Who are like 2 elements that Doom is definitely allowed to take from Quake).

And there's a lot of other examples of "id crossovers" that involve easter eggs, reused assets, coincidences and other stuff that can be obscure or just not really special.

But at the end, most of the "idverse" ends up being a mess because none of it was well planned at all.

It's more of a "sounds cool" sort of thing.

The fun on these crossovers is also seeing specific gameplay elements clash, part of why mods like Samsara are fun (And these classic FPS have a great history of crossover mods; They're fun because they're more "literal" or "mechanical" if you get what i'm saying).

With Quake Champions, we had the id trio (BJ, Doomguy, Ranger) finally be together in a game for the first time but there was barely any buzz around that, like nobody even noticed it.

Though QC as a game feels like it was doomed the minute it wasn't made in a proper id engine.

Also, Doomguy met a BJ Blazkowicz that he's not related to.

No seriously:

90's Doomguy became the Doomslayer but BJ from MachineGames' Wolfenstein is a seperate timeline version from the 90's Wolf 3D BJ.

BJ in the 90's timeline is the grandfather of Commander Keen because he had a son who got into showbiz (Arthur Kenneth Blaze) and BJ's wife is named Julia Marie Peterson.

Meanwhile, MG BJ is the one with Anya and those 2 daughters, then a version of Keen stuck in a cancelled mobile game.

But this whole thing was always weird when you consider Doomguy killing 4 Commander Keen's in D2 and how Wolfenstein RPG had a character named Commander Keen.

Calling Quake "Doom in 3D" isn't a bad thing

It's true that id games have their distinct elements and some people can be ignorant about those.

But it's clear that Quake follows up after Doom, in the same way Doom follows up after Wolfenstein 3D: Mostly a matter of gameplay and tech differences.

Because OG Doom's combat combines enemy placement with level design, Quake does that too (Obviously).

But something that i like in Quake is how the Ring of Shadows literally allows you to sneak around enemies without alerting them: Because this feels like an upgrade to Doom's Blursphere (Some mods make the Blursphere give real invisibility; Pretty much Heretic's Shadowsphere).

Because even though Doom 2016/Eternal take bits from Quake, Quake builds upon Doom's formula with new takes on it, that D16/Eternal technically can't.

Partially because of enemy AI and resources but also because of how enemies are "attached" to level design.

At least by using Quake, that's how you draw a bridge to connect old Doom and the Slayer games.

(I should make that "alternatives for D3" post some day)

Even then, i hate the SP/MP split

I always hated the idea that "Doom is for singleplayer, Quake is for multiplayer" because it's clear both series have their qualities and historical relevance in both fields.

It's why i'm glad that Quake SP mods got a lot of attention some years ago.

And people forget that 2016 Doom's MP was disliked because of how some armors looked and the 2 weapons limit (Because there was a lot of content in it that still looked cool).

And BattleMode would probably be more liked if there were more than 2 player demons fighting the Slayer.

What else? Oh Nince Inch Nails.

The collab with Quake worked because Trent Reznor and id were fans of each other's works, so i'm not sure what the sentiment for Quake 5's OST/sounds would be besides the past association.

But because of how id mistreated Mick Gordon, i don't think anyone wants Trent and others involved at NIN to suffer the same (Specially with how rough he already had in his life, honestly).

I also recall him originally doing sounds for Doom 3 but they were canned (At least plenty of mods bring back the Commandos going "YOUR KIND ARE OVER!").

Anyway, speaking of NIN, you should listen to the Ghost albums.

Not sure what else to add other that the Quake 1 Mission Packs are a blessing and should be acknowledge, like how Doom 64 was finally acknowledged by more people.

Specially when you consider how Quake 1 can feel limited and "Quake 2" is not its actual sequel; So Scourge of Armagon and Dissolution of Eternity feel like to Quake 1 what Doom 2 is to Doom 1.

And while Doom 64's "Unmaker" wasn't an intentional reference to the Doom Bible, Q1 Mission Packs have features directly inspired by Quake's cut ideas.