#as well as with how he does want mike to know and his alan turing poster and his talk with jonathan etc etc
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bylertruther · 1 year ago
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do you ever think about how will probably wishes he was braver?
that he could tell mike the truth about himself without having to speak in code. that he could stick to his guns when he's been wronged and stand up for himself rather than tucking tail and turning the other cheek. that he could be less shy, less sensitive, less cowardly, and maybe then his loved ones wouldn't forget about him as often as they do.
maybe then they would pick him first, rather than leaving him for last. maybe then they would want to hang out with him and hear what he has to say. maybe then they would treat him like they used to, like he can still take care of himself just like they can, instead of like a fragile little thing that they pick up only when they need him. maybe then they would care about him as much as he cares about them. maybe then he wouldn't doubt that it could all come crashing down once they know who he really is, and always has been, because the rest of him would've been enough.
like, maybe he wishes he didn't freeze or run away so much. maybe he wishes he wasn't so afraid all the time, of every little thing. that he could be brave like mike, el, or his mom. i mean, el's been through so much, too. why can't he be more like her? why does he have to hide behind her? he hides behind her when the monsters come crawling back, and he hides behind her when he can't bring himself to say what he really means—even after getting on her case about it.
he spent so much time on that painting. he didn't let anyone see it—it was that special to him. why couldn't he own up to that? there's no monster in the van with him; it's just him and mike and this painting of the party, nothing inherently incriminating or romantic, and still—he can't help himself. he retreats back into the shadow, shrinks into himself, and tells lie after lie to the person that he never lies to, that he knows doesn't fucking deserve that, just because he's too scared.
of course he'd feel like a mistake sometimes. of course he'd hate who he is (if That script is to be believed), when he can't even talk to the one person that would understand without lying straight to his face, over and over again, like a fucking hypocrite. of course he'd feel so lost without the person that tells him it's okay to be this way and shows him that there is indeed strength in it. of course he'd hate who he is when he's encouraging someone to be true and speaking about their courage, all while being incapable of taking his own advice, and giving the credit for all of his love and efforts and emotions to someone else.
so many people died to bring him back, so many people died just because he didn't stay dead when maybe he should have, and for what? so that he can continue to hide rather than live his life? so that he can turn into a "worse" version of himself? so that he can live in fear? so that he can continue to ache for a past that he can never return to, while everyone else moves forward and berates him for not doing the same? time stopped in the upside down when will went missing, and he's been stuck there ever since, too. too much has happened for him to move on from. too much has changed—he's changed. he's too different now, in every way, and the older he gets the more clear it becomes.
of course he'd feel like a mistake. of course he'd hate who he is. he's the common denominator here: in his loneliness and in this war. the boy who came back to life when others didn't. the boy that got possessed and couldn't fight it. the boy that turned into a liar and a coward and must learn to live with it, even if it's at his own expense. the boy that can't let go of the past and whom the past won't let go of either, because even after everything, he's still connected to this great evil that won't let him go. they got it out of him, and yet the tether remains, because of-fucking-course it would.
just—why? why him? why can't anything ever go right with him? why is he always the outlier? i think that overwhelming amount of fear, shame, grief, guilt, exhaustion, and loneliness would wear anyone down, let alone a teenager that never asked for any of it and has experiences so unfathomably unique that the only other people that could have possibly understood are literally dead.
#will byers#byler#mine#long post#will#anyway. this is how i always interpreted the i hate WHO i am line especially in conjunction with the word ''mistake'' + being different#within the context of EVERYTHING that's happened to will and continues to happen to him and how unique it is to him in this narrative#bc rly. if you were will.... wouldn't you feel like a mistake? even outside of that outside of the supernatural i'm speaking to my#friends that have ''Something Wrong'' with them. when something happens to you and you're not the same after and you're surrounded#by people who are able to move on and be normal—don't you ever have those moments where you feel like a mistake? when you're#growing up and still interested in your same old interests but your friends start moving on and then you see that they went back to#those interests in your absence—don't you feel like you were the problem then? when people are able to be brave and you can't#find it within yourself to overcome your fear—don't you hate that feeling? don't you feel that negativity towards yourself when you#know that you SHOULD do something but you can't bring yourself to and it works against yourself? like. everything that has happened#to will E V E R Y T H I N G !!!!!!!!!!!!! can easily make anyone no matter what part of him you relate to the most understand that#u kno wht i mean? anyway. i jus wanted to bring this up bc his life is a fucking tragedy even without the gay stuff n his current pov on th#and the way that That conversation always centers on fear and bravery it's like. obviously being gay is not easy in that era but i don't#think that line is ''i hate being gay'' with no factoring in of the great many things that have happened to him which alienate him further#as well as with how he does want mike to know and his alan turing poster and his talk with jonathan etc etc#his conflict has always centered around how other people treat him and his issue with that bc that's what makes him feel bad#that just because he's different that doesn't mean that he's Different and must be treated as such#he's different and has people that make him feel BETTER for it like look at s2 for example all of those talks abt using what he perceives#as a weakness abt himself as a strength that no one else can bring to the table. and in s3 when he still believed in being a nerd#and never getting girlfriends etc but when it came from mike thts when he called himself stupid n started down this path bc now#there's that sprinkle of doubt. n tht doubt is the scariest thing in the world—understandably so#also. he literally has an evil monster in his brain like bdkfjhsbkdjhfbskj IT'S JUST A LOT.#he is different for many reasons and has even more reasons to hate Who he is the kind of person that he is#jus my take 😁👍
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runninguplenorahills · 2 years ago
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I just wanted to remind everyone that no matter how much better Lenora objectively was for Will than Hawkins, he was not happy there!
Will might’ve not been bullied in Lenora but he had no friends either which was not a deliberate decision btw. I see a lot of people claiming that Will could’ve made friends if he wanted to but didn’t because he rather spent time with El and I just don’t think that’s the case. Will is not an extroverted person who makes the first step when it comes to making new friends. He’s introverted in general and shy when he’s surrounded by people he doesn’t know so making friends is a struggle for him in general and has nothing to do with him sticking with El in Lenora. And while we don’t know anything specific about if Dustin and Lucas sent letters or called Will, we do know that Mike did not. Furthermore it’s canon that Jonathan wasn’t really there for Will during the time spent in Lenora either and while it is never specifically said it is heavily and obviously implied, it’s shown, that Will was in utmost need of his brother’s help and support! And El did not replace Jonathan in that aspect! Jonathan being distant from Will does not and did not equal Will and El becoming close on the level that Will and Jonathan are. I know I talk about this a lot (that willel isn’t as close in canon) but I just had to say it again because to me it seems really clear that a lot of people think that Jonathan not being there for Will somehow led to Will and El sticking together. Like it’s them against the world while that was never the case ever! Will did not once seek comfort in El because Will didn’t simply need a sibling, he needed Jonathan. Jonathan and Will have a close and deep bond and it’s unique because Jonathan isn’t just fulfilling the role of a sibling for Will. So Jonathan cannot just be replaced by another sibling or anyone at all. Point is, when Will realized Jonathan was being distant he started bottling up everything he wanted to talk about. He did not talk to El instead because quite frankly, they don’t have that kind of relationship (El also didn’t tell Will about her and Mike’s problems and the lying).
So Will had no friends in Lenora, he almost lost all connection to his closest friend whom he’s also in love with and his big brother whom he could always count on for support wasn’t really there for him either. Mike and Jonathan are literally the two people Will always knew he could trust with anything because he knew they’d understand in one way or another. But then neither of them was there for him anymore for reasons unknown to Will which lead him to feel as though he can’t talk to either of them anymore. He wanted to talk to them! Desperately! But he just couldn’t. And all of a sudden Will was all alone. Lenora wasn’t fresh and happy and so much better than Hawkins. Lenora was lonely.
Did Lenora allow more room for personal development due to the lack of the upside down and bullying/rumors? Of course it did. Will’s willingness to make and present a project about Alan Turing is hinting at some positive development. In that aspect Lenora was better for Will than Hawkins but in every other aspect it wasn’t, simply because Will was on his own.
The fact that Will felt lost and alone in Lenora is also important for byler’s love story btw. Will telling Mike that he felt lost without him throughout the months he’s spent in Lenora is so significant because it’s a reply to Mike telling Will: “It’s Hawkins. It’s not the same without you.” Mike has called Hawkins his home throughout his entire life but once Will wasn’t there anymore the feeling of being at home left as well. And Will could move anywhere with his family but if Mike’s not there he feels lost nonetheless. The place where they feel like they belong is not a place at all, it’s the state of being together. Will feels found with Mike and Mike feels at home with Will. Mike makes Will feel better for being different and Will makes Mike feel like he’s not alone. Hawkins, Lenora, that doesn’t matter because it’s not about the place!
Will not being happy in Lenora without Mike is exactly as important as Mike not being happy in Hawkins without Will. Erasing that creates a different narrative, destroys the story they’re trying to tell. Simply because people are making it seem like Will can do just fine without Mike while Mike loses his mind without Will which is just not the case. The whole of s4 showed us that Will is not happy without Mike and that he needs him! Will literally tells Mike that he’d fall apart without him and still there are people that try to depict Will as having a good time in Lenora without Mike. Feeding into Mike’s insecurities and undermining Will’s love for Mike! And this is honestly something that makes my blood boil! People who constantly feel the need to undermine Will’s feelings for Mike are completely missing the point.
And this is kinda a different topic but I’ve seen this trend where people headcanon Will to have been on a sports team in Lenora and I just think that these people are once again missing a point that’s been made in the show. Will not being into sports serves a purpose in the telling of his story, It’s a story telling device. And while I do of course know that the focus is on baseball specifically, baseball seems to stand as a symbol for sports in general which then again are a symbol for conforming to society. Being into sports is what society thinks you should be into as a boy. “You shouldn’t like things just because people tell you you’re supposed to” is what Jonathan tells Will in s1 in regards to Will going to baseball games with Lonnie. Will does not like baseball = Will does not like sports = Will does not conform to societal standards. And Lonnie dragging him to the baseball/sports games is him trying to force Will to conform to societal standards. And Basketball was this big symbol of forced conformity in s4. Therefore being into sports and joining a team in Lenora totally defeats the purpose of a rather important story telling device in canon and therefore just isn’t compatible with the character. I’m of course well aware that Will wore a letterman jacket in the stranger things experience clips but owning a letterman jacket doesn’t automatically equal being on a sports team. It was a popular fashion item in the 80’s just like it is today. And I think it’s more likely that Will wore the jacket because he liked the jacket and not because he’s on a sports team because, again, that’d be missing the point. And as I said, the Alan Turing project hints at positive development while Will joining a sports team would hint at negative development so it simply doesn’t make sense for Will to have been on a sports team in Lenora.
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therainscene · 2 years ago
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Something that struck me about Will’s bedroom in S4 is how asexually it’s decorated:
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This boy is about to turn 15 and yet there’s not a single hunk to be found anywhere on his walls! Being closeted isn’t an excuse -- there’s plenty of plausible deniability in having posters of your favourite musicians, athletes, characters, etc, as our extremely heterosexual friend Michael can demonstrate:
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Perhaps Will just is asexual. After all, outside of his chaste love for Mike, we only ever see him express his sexuality in the form of revulsion towards girls/heterosexuality; he honestly seems kind of neutral on men in general.
However... I don’t think that’s what’s going on here.
Will happens to conform to certain 80s stereotypes about gay men -- he’s sensitive, well-groomed, prefers art over sport -- and these traits have made him a target for homophobic abuse, probably since before he even realized he was gay.
Imagine how it must have felt, then, when he finally did realize he was gay. The bullies were right about that, all along. So what else were they right about?
What other stereotypes plagued gay men in the 80s? They were seen as threats that wanted to recruit children into their “lifestyle”...
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...as disgusting perverts...
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...and as carriers of disease.
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Even as a 12 year-old with an innocent crush on his best friend, this poor kid already feels ashamed of a sexuality he hasn’t even matured into yet. So when he does start maturing into it, he represses it.
It’s no wonder that he identifies with Alan Turing, a man who was chemically castrated for being gay.
Who else do we know who might identify with what happened to Alan Turing?
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Henry is queer-coded by way of parallels to Will: he’s sensitive, well-groomed, and likes art. Like Will, he had a parent who tried to make him more “normal”. Like Will, he’s suffered abuse for being different.
But Henry is also queer-coded in a way that parallels those homophobic fears about “the gay agenda”: he preys on children, recruiting some and killing the rest. He’s angry at the world for not having space in it for people like him, but it doesn’t occur to him that he could peacefully co-exist with the rest of society -- he wants to burn it all down and remake the world in his own image.
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The thing is, homophobes are telling on themselves when they express such fears about gay men -- because what they fear queer people will do to them is what heteronormative society is already doing to queer people. Like Henry, they think this is a zero-sum game in which only one side can “win”.
So I don’t think Henry’s queer-coding is meant to be read literally as him being a predatory gay man.
Rather, he’s a personification of homophobia: the homophobe’s gay boogeyman made flesh.
(When it comes to other characters, he personifies a more broadly-applicable version of this concept. But the Duffers have stated that S5 will focus heavily on Will and his coming of age, so I think this queer reading of Vecna is a deliberate and central one.)
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If Vecna represents external homophobia, then the Mind Flayer represents internalized homophobia.
Vecna sends it after Will and it literally gets inside him, burying his true nature under a layer of torment. It’s partially defeated when his family and friends see what’s happening and shower him with unconditional love, but it lingers at the back of his head as he starts to go through puberty, flaring up when he’s near or otherwise thinking about Mike.
The only time he doesn’t have to deal with these flare-ups is when he’s in California, far away from both Vecna and the homophobic town he grew up in. And he gains a lot of confidence in his identity while he’s there!
But, as the asexually-decorated bedroom suggests, he still feels a lot of shame too.
Will can’t fully self-actualize as a gay man until he breaks his connection with Vecna once and for all...
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...with the boy who makes him feel like he’s not a mistake by his side.
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hawkinsschoolcounselor · 2 years ago
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So if Byler does become canon, how do you think they’ll pull it off, based off what you’ve seen? I feel like El will have to move on from Mike first, or end the relationship, or else it will just make Mike seem like even more of an ass for not returning her feelings after all of this. I see no other explanation for Mikes behavior other than repressed homosexuality and projection, but I still have zero clue how they’ll pull it off. maybe all of this is just building up to one big love confession from Mike to El. I have no idea what to think rn.
I think things are in motion for Mike and El to break up, but it's still ambiguous enough that it could go either way.
Mike still can't tell El he loves her, and El has noticed. El seems to be realizing that he isn't the one who can love her the way she wants. However, they could still pull a big "character development" moment where Mike realizes he loves her and becomes exactly what El needs.
However, they also made Mike's behavior with Will odd from the start. The aborted hug at the airport was very different from their goodbye in season 3 where they were clinging to each other. Him ignoring Will most of the first day was odd, too. He seemed to be putting deliberate space between them. Then we find out that Mike hadn't written Will at all, simply calling a few times. That really has me thinking that Mike did write, but never mailed the letters.
With how much Will's character seems to be getting pushed away from the actual plot, there's legit nothing left for him but his sexuality. That's horrible enough as it is, especially going into Pride month. Even his report on Alan Turing, which we didn't even get to see, hasn't come into play at all. So far, it simply seems to be a Genius Bonus for people who know Turing was, essentially, a gay nerd.
God, Will was so happy he cried anytime Mike actually treated him well. That sounds sweet, but it's actually pretty sad. They've made Will so one-dimensional that all that there is for him is Mike. They were touching moments, and it was because Mike was being honest, but the kid deserves to have more to him than just Mike.
It better be leading to something.
And if it isn't...
Well...
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Who's with me?
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hawkinsschoolcounselor · 3 years ago
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004 Teaser Breakdown
Ok, now that I’m (reasonably) calm, I will attempt to take a look at the teaser to see what we’re dealing with here.
For reference, please see the teaser linked below.
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I will focus on “chunks” of the teaser, rather than try to analyze it as a whole.
I’ll be nice and add a break here to keep a long post off people’s feeds.
We’ll start with the biggest part of it: El’s letter to Mike. 
El writes this letter on “day 185.” We don’t really know what that means, but it could refer to, as an Ask suggested to me, how long El has been in California. That probably is the most obvious explanation, but it runs against what we know of the timeline. The season 3 epilogue takes place “three months later,” which is somewhere around October, given that the season itself took place in early July. 185 days would be about 6 months later, which would put the writing of this letter in very late March or early April. Given that Easter in 1986 was in late March, and the school calendar we saw in set photos a year or so ago showed Spring Break at that time, this is odd.
It’s possible that they changed the timeline a bit after we saw that set photo. What would be especially odd to me is that this would skip over Will’s birthday, which seemed to be a natural fit. Mike visiting not only for Spring Break, but Will’s birthday, made a lot of sense. I suppose it’s possible that they didn’t think to include Will’s birthday, and they changed the timeline accordingly. However, even if this letter is being written in early April, and Mike visits a little after that, it would be strange to not mention Will’s birthday.
Another possibility is that the Byers left in September, not October. It would make more sense to move before the start of the school year, or, at least, very early on. If this were the case, then the letter would be written in early March, which would perfectly set up the timeline we already expected. One way or the other, though, there’s a timeline discrepancy. 
Ok, back to the content of the letter.
One thing to note, before I continue, is that the majority of the letter is a lie. We’ll break down each part. 
“I think I have finally adapted.”
Maybe. I mean, she’s going to school, and she’s developed skills and hobbies, probably with the Byers’ help. That diorama seems rather well made, not to mention made with love.
“I even like school now. I have made lots of friends.”
No, sadly. She seems like she’s trying, but she does not appear to have friends in this teaser. In fact, she gets outright ignored or bullied in the interactions we see.
“Even so, I am ready for Spring Break.”
Ok, yeah, probably. 
“Most because I get to see you.”
While I’m sure she wants to see him, I think she just wants the break.
“We will have the best Spring Break ever.”
Not that she has much in terms of a point of comparison, but, no. We have the benefit of audience omniscience here, so perhaps not technically a lie, but still false.
Now we can look at some other things.
Will is painting now, and his room is full of things he apparently made himself, including a reproduction of a Cure album cover.
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It’s from Boys Don’t Cry, which probably has some significance that I don’t have time to get into here.
El and Will walk down the hall at school together, which is a hint that we might finally see them bond. 
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El is carrying her Hopper diorama, and Will has a poster of Alan Turing. I’m told there was some leak (ugh) that they had to do a project on their heroes. El’s certainly makes sense, and it’s heartbreakingly precious. Will’s, though? We never had any inkling that he admired Alan Turing, or that he was particularly into computers and codes outside of his membership in the AV Club and knowledge of Morse Code. Let’s not dance around this, either. Alan Turing was, and still remains, one of the biggest victims of homophobia in Western culture. There’s no way someone who knows him well enough to do a project on him wouldn’t know of this. Will knows Turing is gay, but did the project on him anyway.
Next, Mike is on his bed reading a letter. It’s ostensibly this letter, but it could be another one since, as TVTropes says, Trailers Always Lie.  Watch it turn out to not even be a letter at all, but something else entirely.
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The hell you wearing, Mike? I really need context for this, because this is definitely not how he dressed for school, and we’re not likely to see a weekend day until Spring Break starts. 
Also, the One Way sign of an arrow pointing to his closet is a bit...yeah. If Mike isn’t gay, then the Duffers are just being mean here. They literally have an arrow pointing to a closet. That’s as heavy-handed as it gets.
Next, Joyce gets sent a Russian doll. 
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We kinda saw this coming with the dolls the show sent out to certain fans with large social media followings. I don’t know if these are the same types of dolls, but they’re Russian in origin. The package full of stamps also suggests it may well have been sent from Russia, or at least overseas. Do Hopper and the Russian smuggler guy manage to get a message out? How does he know where to find Joyce, though?
A lot happens next, and all fairly quickly.
The Byers home is invaded by...someone.
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An apparent argument between Mike and Jonathan is interrupted when someone breaks the window. Someone is next to Mike, but it’s impossible to tell who it is.
We have vans and police cars going down a desert road. The van is probably the same one from this photo.
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Speaking of that photo, I have a feeling that we see one of these men in this teaser. 
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Someone is shooting back at the people invading the Byers house. He’s dressed like your typical movie detective, so he fits in with the two in the photo with El. I think that maybe some (relatively) reasonable police or government agents are investigating something, only for some genuinely bad people (Brenner’s men?) to show up. It’s tough to follow this fast-cutting sequence, but we don’t really see much of El, which leads me to think that she might get captured here.
We have a shot of Mike and Will inside the van looking very scared/dire.
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I wonder if El has been hurt here. Will seems numb and speechless, but Mike seems to be in shock. Maybe they’re looking back at the house after making a getaway? 
There’s a shot of someone in front of an explosion, similar to the now well-known burning car scene.
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Whoever it is, their hair seems short and they’re wearing a flannel shirt and white pants. There’s a white shirt under the flannel. This is a signature Will look, though El is also wearing flannel, too. Still, it doesn’t look like her hair. Here’s Will’s body double, though.
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And here’s a photo I just saw today.
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Nothing is certain, but it could really be Will. I’m not saying he caused the explosion, necessarily, but I’m not not saying that, either.
Unfortunately, we have to wait for this summer, apparently, to find out.
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