#I know it has some overlap with the poly community but it's still a form of monogamy due to the lack of others involvement

[greateggcult]

ok yeah, I would probably be the the orange and black, but still functionally aro due to my version of romance not being typically considered romance and me not having much interest or ability to comply with the normal stuff.

Even in the rare cases where I would want romance it isn't exactly viable due to the cultures surrounding it and the needs of the typical person.

I would imaging it more like metaphorically being with a stray cat made human, or the planet's orbit, than it is the lovey dovey stuff. a strange sort of companionship beyond the platonic but not meeting the qualifications to be really considered romantic. something more like the changing of seasons. lacking the constant need for company but still maintaining the security of knowing they'll be back eventually. Something with plenty of breathing room but not lacking warmth. The ability to have time alone without the isolation or the pressure. The love is there without the hunger that people seem to see as a requirement.

It sucks that others would feel this sort or thing as torment, and don't blame them. I imagine to lots it would be like fasting and not everybody is built for that, the same way that others aren't built for constant affection.

So this sort of thing would likely have to be mutual or else it's not viable. It's a strand of hay in a gigantic mixed assortment needle stack. Not impossible but highly unlikely and a nightmare to find in the current state of things.

hey black stripe for romantic individuals who go against the traditional culture of romance is pretty based actually. i wish we still talked about that

[aroacepagans]

That last post has me thinking about Paganism in connection to alternative relationship structures, and how Morning Glory Zell-Ravenheart, who coined the term polyamory, also helped to found the first registered Neopagan church in the U.S. and how that might be relevant for those of us who are both a-spec and Pagan.

We talk a lot about how the poly community and a-spec community overlap, interact and share values due to an allowance for non-normative relationship styles. For those of us who practice some form of Neopagan spiritual tradition, I think this can also help link us to our religious communities. Personally, I have always viewed Pagan spiritual space as being a place for alternative relationship models. I think more than half of the other Pagans I know are poly or otherwise queer, and those who aren't still often participated in cis, heterosexual, monogamy in a non-normative way. This is due, at least partially, to the shared history and community values of Paganism and polyamory.

From an aroace perspective then, I can say that growing up in Pagan spaces gave me many different examples of how a non-normative relationship might work. It lessened my anxiety about what the future would look like as an aroace, because I could see a large portion of my community building their relationships, families, and support networks in a way that didn't fit the norm. That understanding creates a wholeness to my identities. My spiritual identity helped build a framework for my queer identity to grab onto, and so my aro-ness is part of my ace-ness, my aroace-ness is part of my pagan-ness, and my relationship anarchy and non-monogamy is wrapped up in all of it.

Anyways, I'm interested to know if other neopagan a-specs also feel this connection between their identity and their spirituality. I know these values can shift a little across religion and congregation, so I would love to hear people's thoughts.

[dilutedheartbeat]

So, there's a weird part about growing up queer in a queer family, surrounded by fellow queers of all walks of life. You still get shit on by the world, and it hurts - hurts SO FUCKING MUCH - but there's a disconnect there, as well. After all, my family understands. They truly do understand the pain of changing what parts of you that you share with the world, with your friends at school and at their homes.

I already did this because of our religion, the additional editing barely registered.

I take that back, I was more open about being raised a Witch by other Witches than I was that sometimes I didn't feel like a girl or that girls and boys were roughly equally interesting. I was more open about the fact that we could name every single person who had passed on our religion going back over 500 years than the fact that several of my Aunts and Uncles in the community - both the Queer and the Pagan, and there were several that, like us, lay in the overlap - crossed gender boundaries in one way or another.

I grew up knowing first-hand how the AIDS crisis affected people. My Uncle Clemeth died when I was around 7 years old. I hadn't seen him in months because of the rules for the hospice house, after a lifetime of seeing him a few times a month. I'd barely seen his partner (not husband, because that was still over 20 years away, and not his domestic partner because that was still about 15 years off) in that time, because he'd been at the hospice house every day, every second he could, watching the love of his life waste away. The only person that could spend any time with him was the in-home caregiver who'd been caring for Clemeth before he got too ill, and I am very happy to say that the two of them are still together, still taking care of each other now as legally recognized spouses.

I grew up never worrying that my parents would be disappointed in whatever path I took. I was extremely privileged for that, and only wish I could do the same for my own kids (their father's family has them terrified of their own shadows, and I am slowly working through legal shit trying to get them away from that). I didn't have to worry that my parents would tear up my books or posters, destroy my jewelry or clothes over me choosing a different religious path. That I had been vocal since about 3 years old regarding which Gods called to me actually never factored into any of that. I didn't have to worry that my openly Bi parents, who were also openly polyamorous, would every shame me for my sexual wants or desires; they only made sure that I could talk to them about what I wanted or needed, and would help me safely explore.

I can still laugh at my mom buying me my first vibrator when I was 16, and the years later conversation in my twenties about how sex was weird as I'd recently discovered.

I can also still feel the warmth of her rage when she learned some of the shit that asshole pulled, and the way I felt safe telling her. I hope my siblings could feel the ice of my own when he tried to target them later.

I grew up going to Pride, marching in it, gleefully introducing my first girlfriend to my parents, even though we were only "out" to a handful of friends at school. I still think of her fondly, and hope she's well. I got to grow up around IT workers, social workers, authors, sex workers, tattooists, and people from every other walk of life. I got to dye my hair, cut it however I wanted. I got to choose when I got my first piercing, where it was (my ears, boringly enough, at age 4, though i plan on at least two more once it's safe) and when I wanted to gauge up they got me the jewelry and had me talk to some fellow poly Pagan friends about care and taking it slow.

When, at age 8 I was repeatedly trying to kill myself, my parents sought help. One of them sat me down and talked about her own struggles, and they found me a professional to talk to, and they made an effort to spend more time with me. Just because my problem was bigger than that didn't mean it didn't help, and they checked with me regularly about it; when I was in high school and spiraled heavily, they got me to the doctor, talked to her and let me talk to her privately, and reminded me to take the meds I was prescribed. When that med didn't help, they listened to me after I had to change to an entirely different med class, and shared their happiness that I was doing better.

They had learned after not listening to my younger sister, you see. My parents aren't perfect, and that whole talk I had when I was 8 scarred me heavily. Don't fucking tell your kids that you have it worse, okay? And maybe, just maybe listen when your kid tells you that the prozac makes them too manic and don't insist they can't be bipolar like mom's side of the family only depressed like yours, nearly killing your kid in the process. My sister is much better these days, but that was one of the first big experiences after the amnesia, and is still understandably bitter over it. Our older sibling and I are, too.

As an adult, I still had to deal with people being bigoted pieces of shit, now without the buffer of my parents. I had to deal with abusers who saw my barely acknowledged bisexuality as an easy target. I had to deal with classmates and coworkers mocking a later boyfriend for being gay. He wasn't, is still straight and cis, and unfortunately now a shitty dad, but because he taught ballroom dance that made him gay apparently. I still had to deal with lesbians insisting I just needed to pick a side. I still had to deal with homophobia, and biphobia, on top of defending my religion.

People fucking suck, okay?

As an adult, who grew up queer in a queer family surrounded by a queer community, though, it has brought me great pleasure to watch people try to make bigoted arguments, to convince me that somehow, at some time in some way I understood (understand) why it's a problem to let people be who they are. It's not a moral standpoint. It's not an ethical standpoint. They just really can't comprehend that I don't hate myself on some level, because I was never taught to. My exposure to that kind of bullshit was extremely limited to public school and visiting my grandmothers. Even then, the kids didn't know what they didn't know, and at least one of my grandmothers only cared that she got to see us.

Every place we went, every one of my parents' friends we visited, I was surrounded by people who were queer or part of my religion, and frequently both. I was aware there were bigots in the broader Pagan community, but my parents didn't have the time for that, so it wasn't really in my sphere. I could be me, in public. If I was a boy that day, I was a boy that day, and no one said boo about it.

Even now, years and years later, seeing the uptick in TERF bullshit and purity bullshit and people trying to rewrite the history of my communities (both queer and pagan, and they can all fuck right off), I'm not ashamed. I'm not confused. I am who I always have been. Labels may have changed with time as people find new words that fit them better, but even as safe as my upbringing was, we all still are part of the same community; the world outside still existed, my parents simply took the hits for me.

I guess the reason I'm writing all this, sharing all this when I usually keep my personal stuff offline is that I'm seeing a lot of queer people under every label talking about how they somehow can't do all... ^^this... for their own future kids - whatever form those kids come in. Y'all, my parents are a Boomer and a Gen Xer. I'm still doing what I can for my kids. There's not a cis-het person in my immediate family! You can do this.

Please don't give up hope, or leave that hope to the wider world being more acceptable. That acceptance comes at the cost of lives and loves and so much time. Raise your kids in the community. Adopt kids in the community. Be an Aunt or Uncle or Adjacent Adult Figure of whatever term fits! Let kids know themselves and that you are there for them. I believe in you.

[hakuoki-dreams]

Hi, i'm so glad you aswered! I was thinking like Sano/OC/Shin for the poly ask. Thank you son much!!

Starting a poly relationship with Shinpachi and Sanosuke…I’m not sure whether to applaud your taste or ask if you have a deathwish! 😉 But here’s my best shot at how it might go:

                                        —————————

This will be a very, very big ask for either of them

Neither of these guys is especially jealous or possessive per se, but both of them are a little old-fashioned with romance in their own ways. Neither one has ever pictured themselves in this kind of situation with the girl they eventually fell for

Their individual reactions when you try to bring up the subject one-on-one:

Of the two of them, Sano is probably more open-minded in general. He won’t like the idea of sharing you in a relationship, but he’ll try to listen and not immediately shut you down. He can tell you’re serious about this and will match your mood. Inside he’ll be very concerned–he definitely sees a family and kids in his future, and he’s worried that it sounds like your needs might potentially be at odds with each other. Out of deep affection for you, he’ll do his best to hear you out and consider what you’re saying.

Shin will be a little more hurt, unfortunately. No matter how carefully you phrase it, to him it’ll confirm all his fears that he’s not enough for you. He won’t get angry, but he’ll have to leave for a while to be alone and think about it over a drink. He’s had multi-partner sexual experiences–although not with another guy–so it’s really not the idea of sex with a third person that bothers him so much. More so it’s the idea of sharing you emotionally, and having another person’s feelings in the mix to consider. He’s fearful that it would drive a wedge between you two and cause you to drift away from him.

But no matter who you decide to bring it up with first, when you get them together for a talk between all three of you, they’ll be dazed to realize just who you had in mind to complete this love triangle. Their first reactions will be the exact same: intense embarrassment

They’re practically brothers. They’ve risked their lives side by side in combat, lived together for years, have honestly seen each other naked in enough locker-room-type situations that it doesn’t even phase them anymore.

But this? This is just…beyond the pale

The idea of being brought into a very close and intimate relationship with each other, even with you in the middle, isn’t something that had remotely crossed either of their minds. In the moment, they’d almost rather it had been a complete stranger

The atmosphere in the room is a stark change from the easy camaraderie you’re used to around these two. Both will be very stiffly looking in opposite directions, wishing they were anywhere else besides here having this conversation.

They’ll have to get drunk together to even think about talking to each other about it. After half a dozen hasty rounds or so, some of the awkwardness has finally faded with help from good old liquor. Never one to be caught speechless for long, Sano probably breaks the silence first:

‘So before just now…did she tell you who, or…?’

‘No. You?’

‘Nope.’

‘Ah.’

Shin will drop his head onto the table and let out some choice curse words. Sano will nod in sober agreement. There’s another long silence in which both of them are picturing many vivid hypotheticals. They won’t just be worrying about your feelings. As strange and unfamiliar as it is to be concerned with, neither guy really wants to see the other get hurt if they can help it.

After some more private contemplation on both sides, they’ll find themselves drifting toward an uneasy middle ground. They’ll share a resigned glance that communicates something like well…if it had to be any other guy.

In the sober light of day, the early weeks will still be incredibly awkward. Neither one has an inkling how to make this work. They’re going to leave it up to you to decide all the boundaries, to your chagrin.

For a while it feels like you’re in two different relationships, not a single connected one. You certainly find yourself spending a lot of time with both of them–just not together.

There are many gawky hand-offs as a result. They like to meticulously plan their time with you so that there’s no overlap. It still happens, and it makes you all cringe inside.

Shin picks you up for a date and walks in on you and Sano kissing in the kitchen. He rubs a hand through his hair at the sight, sort of coughs to announce his presence. Later on Sano comes looking for you in the morning and finds you leaving Shin’s room hand-in-hand with him. Both turn redder than you’ve ever seen them, but they don’t say anything and sort of pass you along

You find yourself hiding your face in your hands a lot

It definitely puts a strain on their friendship at first. They both care a lot about you, and it makes them feel like true rivals for the first time in their lives. They don’t enjoy the feeling, but they’re not sure how to get past it.

Time can help thaw even the most uncomfortable affairs, however. The situation slowly becomes routine, if not entirely relaxed. You do your utmost to love on them both equally. And thankfully, alcohol always remains as the eternal equalizer among you three.

It will be a very, very long time before you three share a bed, and it’ll be after a night of heavy drinking on all sides. Everyone collectively decides they’ve had about enough of the tip-toeing around–you all used to be such good pals with each other before all this, and you know what? Fuck it

Afterward there’s a marked shift in dynamic between the two of them. They’re not rivals anymore so much as players on the same team. Where before you could deal with their individual charms one at a time, you’re now stuck in the middle with both their arms around you as they compete to see who can woo you better. Rather than getting embarrassed themselves, they turn their attention on you and see who can get you to blush or smile first.

It would be extremely unfair if you weren’t enjoying yourself so much

At the end of good days, you find yourself wedged between their sleeping forms, a tangle of sweaty skin and arms–wondering if you can actually handle what you’ve gotten yourself into

[weaselle]

“So, my gf is new to her...polyiness (?) Tips on helping her navigate?”

Yes! This is going to be a little long, because it’s a bit “explain poly for beginners” but I’d love to, so here we go. First, thanks for giving me permission to answer your question more publicly, where it might be of interest/help to others :) Now, for YOU, I would recommend letting her lead. Since she’s new to it (but the implication is you are not) don’t push her to do or be anything specific, let her go where and when she’s comfortable. This could be tricky, as I don’t know if you have other partners already, how long the two of you have been together, how experienced in non-poly relationships she is, etc. That said, I’ll put down some stuff that helped me early on, that your GF might find helpful as well. Okay, so, everybody is different, but for me what has been extremely helpful is 1: having a base concept 2: finding comparable overlap in other kinds of relationships 3: being extremely honest about negative feelings within yourself 4: being extremely open to working within your partner(s) feelings and                    parameters (this last one is a good reminder for you as well, OP) 1: base concept when I was 16 and 17 and considering love, I wanted to find my soulmate etc etc. But I also had all these fantasies/life goals of having a lot of sexy adventures with various people throughout my life. How sad would it be if I actually did find my soulmate at 18, I thought, it would mean saying no to all that other stuff. And then I thought, but it would be sad for my partner too! Surely they also had many similar fantasies and desires - if I really loved them, I would never want to be the reason they couldn’t have as fulfilled a life as possible. Now of course, I have a much more personal and nuanced base concept I work off, but it’s still formed around that initial thought: if I really care for someone, I want them to be free to experience everything that makes them happy. I dated someone who’s concept included “it’s unfair to expect a single other person to be all the things I need” and I still think about that often, too. 2: comparable overlap in other relationships You can have several close friends, right? Remember how figuring out the “best friend” thing was weird in like, 5th or 7th grade or whatever? There were likely even some fights or fallings out over it? That’s all the same kind of jealousies and stuff you’ll deal with in a poly relationship. And hey! you learned to deal with all of that so well in friendships that it’s second nature to you now, right? Also, your partners are going to go out on dates and have sex with other partners (though oddly, for me, it’s the quiet study sessions together and things like that which have the potential to bother me more than the sex). It can be helpful to put that in the perspective of other situations. For instance, if I have a close friend, and they go to a concert with some other close friend of theirs and don’t invite me even though I like that band, I don’t get mad at them or upset or too jealous or anything... but also, I don’t necessarily enjoy hearing them talk about what a great time they had at the concert.  It’s similar with my partners and dates. I don’t need them to never talk about their other partners, but also, I don’t really need to hear details about their good times. This is helpful both for examining the way I feel about things, as well as communicating it in a way that is intrinsically understandable for my partners, and allows us to create boundaries without needing letter-of-the-law rules. 3: Be extremely honest about negative feelings within yourself. Being honest about your negative feelings is a must. My current partner is dating a woman who is a professional dominatrix, and THAT lady is married, and my partner used to date both of them simultaneously. But there were jealousy issues among them that made it not work out well; all parties are experienced in navigating these relationships, and the solution for them was that my partner no longer dates the husband (this was all before I entered the picture) When I was first in poly relationships, I discovered that it wasn’t the sex that made me jealous, it was the socio-emotional closeness. Turns out my jealousies center around a not-necessarily-healthy need to be loved THE MOST. For a long time, I dealt with this by having a Primary Partner, wherein it can be acceptable to insist on being the most important. If I was not honest about how I felt, I wouldn’t have known this was a possible solution.  These days I don’t lean on this concept so much, but I think it can be a real help for navigating trickier aspects of poly relationships, especially for beginners (for example: you have two partners, one is having a significant birthday, and one has their paintings in an art show for the first time... on the same night. If one of them is your Primary partner and you have been very clear about this, then everyone already knows which event you will be attending). 4: be extremely open to working within your partners’ parameters. This one is also a reminder for you, Questioner. The idea is to be willing to explore your own limits of what you can be happy with, while at the same time being willing to observe the boundaries your partner(s) have. Part of this is recognizing and communicating your own boundaries. Part of it is being open to and respectful of your partners needs. This one is pretty straight forward. hope this has been of any use, good luck and have fun!

[bi-sapphics]

nah, you know what? i’m the anon and your response is even stupider than i’d expected (i took the assumption from this post and was really hoping you’d say you weren’t implying that due to the wording). like, buzzwords??? where??? all i said was exclus aren’t inherently TERFs and taking away the focus from trans exclusionary radical feminists to being about anything other than trans women is transmisogynistic. that’s not something i randomly pulled out of my ass and it has nothing to do with other forms of bigotry in the modern queer community. talk to any trans woman and they will tell you this - and if you don’t care about that and think what i’m saying is unimportant, you’re just blatantly and purposefully being transmisogynistic. it doesn’t look good for you either way.

i understand that all TERFs are exclus. that’s kinda part of the overlapping recipe and there’s no denying it. but exclusionism itself is not inherently TERFy or related to radfem ideology and you need to understand that difference. exclus hanging out in the main LGBT circles don’t use TERFy arguments; you claim otherwise because you think TERF means “people i disagree with and think are wrong” and nothing pisses me off more than that mindset because it shows you have absolutely zero critical thinking skills - you’re a radinclus in favor of all “good-faith” identities, so i expected nothing better, but at least most of you can think of an argument when you run into discourse. in fact, it’s fucking ironic as hell that you claim i filled that ask with nothing but buzzwords when that’s literally exactly how you’re using the term “TERF.”

i want to make a note that these are either no longer my arguments or even that i personally agree or disagree, but generally speaking, saying cishets aros & aces don’t belong with the LGBT (regardless of whether or not you think they should form their own exclusive community) does not make the believer a radfem. saying pansexuality has biphobic and very recent origins does not make the preacher a radfem. some people claiming they are not comfortable being personally called queer because it’s still a slur and setting boundaries is not a radfem argument. none of these statements tell you what you should or shouldn’t do for yourself. and even if they are worded in a way that changes that, no one can make you change your mind and do what they want. that’s not how radfems work. radfems are manipulative and talk about biology like it’s a moral failing. radfems push to make women who are not lesbians feel uncomfortable existing without alternatives. radfems support laws that greatly hurt trans people on a large scale. these communities without the overlap are not the same. exclus criticize certain labels and their placements, not the validity of people being who they are. they even offer alternatives and compromises (aces & aros making an exclusive community to describe their oppression that doesn’t fit under the homophobia & transphobia umbrellas, omnis/polys/pans using bi as a catch-all for every mspec experience, mspec “lesbians” using bi sapphic and other non-harmful labels that imply a dedication to women only, etc.).

i would actually be willing to say many transmeds (whom i am heavily against btw) use TERF rhetoric when it comes to trans people, but that still doesn’t make them all TERFs, because they are obviously very much pro-trans, even if they’re not quite caught up with what modern acceptance looks like and means yet. so some are, some aren’t. but none of them are known for being transmisogynistic, which is the baseline of being trans-exclusionary and a radfem (y’know, the acronym!!). a transmed is much more likely to help the cause to fight transmisogyny than a cis woman who thinks she’s the only right kind of woman and part of the only group to experience misogyny.

that isn’t fucking TERF rhetoric. you have this mindset that all exclus are TERFs, rather than the opposite, all TERFs are exclus (but not all exclus are TERFs). again, i used to be an exclusionist. i’m not anymore. i am aware of both queer & radfem history (and i’m constantly learning, studying, reading about, and talking about it all the time) and if you actually looked at it you would see that it supports this philosophy. but you don’t, because everyone who doesn’t share your opinions about validation is a TERF to you. frankly, if i were 6 whole years older than i am now, in my 20s, and thinking the way you do i’d be embarrassed once i found some self-awareness.

i type all this out but i know you won’t even read any of it because it’s just gonna be a load of “TERF bullshit” to you. to you, i’ll be a TERF even though the smallest look through my profile would tell you i am nowhere near meeting the qualifications. fuck you. i’ll just block you before you make my brain hurt even more.

omg you are 23 and out here thinking pan and aro/ace exclus are TERFs, please grow the fuck up. i'm not even an exclus anymore and i'm here to say you're being blatantly transmisogynistic by refocusing the meaning of the acronym.

Wow that sure is a lot of buzzwords! Good for you!

Ace/aro exclus and panphobes have been using TERF arguments for years now, and so many of them are just straight up TERFs. If you used to be an exclus and you aren't even aware of the history of the bigotry these groups spew, that's a you problem. Either grow up and get off anon or suck my tits, I don't give a fuck about you randomly calling me a transmisogynist for -checks notes- being literate in the modern history of bigotry in the queer community.

[a-dinosaur-a-day]

gryfftech replied to your post “And with that, #Raptormonth and #Birds are Dinosaurs Week are over!”

I feel so out of it, I don't know what half of those terms are. But I still support this month!

I actually really love defining stuff, so @gryfftech, prepare yourself for some rad definitions under the cut

Gay - an umbrella term that applies to anyone who exclusively is attracted to the same gender as themself; however, is often used for men/partial men (such as demiboys) who fit this condition. 

Achillean - Men who are attracted to other Men (mlm) (also applies to nonbinary people who identify at least partially with Man and apply this label to themselves) 

Lesbian - "A person who is a woman or partially a woman who feels attraction, be it romantic and/or sexual, to other women and partial women.” 

Sapphic - Women who are attracted to other Women (wlw) (also applies to nonbinary people who identify at least partially with Woman and apply this label to themselves) 

Andro/Masc/Masexual/romantic - When one is attracted to men and/or masculine genders/individuals (these types of orientations are useful for nonbinary people who don’t want to use the terms gay or straight) 

Gyne/Fem/Womasexual/romantic - When one is attracted to women and/or feminine genders/individuals 

Diamoric - A flexible term that has two different definitions:  1) A nonbinary person who prioritizes nonbinary people and nonbinary partnerships in their life  2) A relationship that involves at least one nonbinary individual (even if one of the people involved is binary) 

Enbian - A nonbinary person attracted to other nonbinary people (nblnb) (like sapphic & achillean) 

Ceterosexual/romantic - Someone who is exclusively attracted to nonbinary genders (really only usable by nonbinary people) 

Bisexual/romantic - Someone who is attracted to two or more genders 

Polysexual/romantic - Someone who is attracted to three or more genders, or all genders to the exclusion of one, etc. 

Pansexual/romantic - Someone who is attracted to all genders, or attracted to people independent of gender 

Multisexual/romantic - Someone who is attracted to multiple genders; or a term used for the entire community of people who fit this description (bi, poly, pan, etc.) 

Pluralian - An umbrella term for people who are attracted to more than one gender; one who prioritizes, or is proud of, all the genders to whom they are attracted equally; one who celebrates their multiple attraction; the community of people who are attracted to more than one gender; a descriptor of the attraction someone who is attracted to multiple genders feels towards anyone of any gender -> a term that is similar/aligns with “sapphic” and “achillean” and “enbian,” and can be used as a replacement for words such as gay, straight, and diamoric when pluralian/mspec people describe their attraction towards other people 

Asexual - Someone who does not experience sexual attraction 

Graysexual - Someone who experiences sexual attraction less so/differently than others 

Demisexual - Someone who only experiences sexual attraction once they have formed a deep emotional connection with someone else 

Aromantic - Someone who does not experience romantic attraction

Grayromantic - Someone who experiences romantic attraction less so/differently than others

Demiromantic - Someone who only experiences romantic attraction once they have formed a deep emotional connection with someone else 

Akoi/Lithsexual/romantic - Someone who feels attraction but it fades when reciprocated, or when a relationship is entered, or a person who feels attraction but has no desire to have the feelings reciprocated 

Intersex - An individual whose biological characteristics do not fit into the biological models of male and female 

Trans - An individual who does not completely, no-holes-barred identify with the gender they were assigned at birth 

Nonbinary - An individual who identifies with a gender outside of the societal binary of man/woman; used as both an umbrella term as well as just a gender in and of itself

Genderqueer - An individual with a gender identity outside of the gender binary, or with an identity other than man and woman (yes, this is very similar to nonbinary) 

Maverique - A gender characterized by autonomy and inner conviction that is entirely independent of male, female, or anything derived from the binary genders which is not without gender or a neutral gender; a distinct and firm Other Gender 

Agender - Someone who does not have a gender/experiences no gender whatsoever

Neutrois - Someone who has a neutral or null gender

Genderless - Someone without gender, or with a neutral or null gender, etc. (all three of these have a lot of overlap) 

Genderfluid - Someone whose gender changes over time, or has a gender identity that changes 

Genderflux - Someone who experiences shifts or changes in the intensity of their gender 

Demigirl - Someone who is in part, but not entirely, a girl/experiences the woman gender only in part 

Demiboy - Someone who is in part, but not entirely, a boy/experiences the man gender only in part 

Demifluid - Someone who is in part, but not entirely, genderfluid

Deminonbinary - Someone who is in part, but not entirely, Nonbinary 

Proxvir - A gender relative to male, but is something separate and entirely on it’s own 

Juxera - A gender relative to female, but is something separate and entirely on it’s own 

Xenogender - A gender that cannot be defined in terms of the male/female gender binary or any typical terms that are used to describe gender; and is thus described utilizing other terms (such as descriptors of nature, music, etc.) 

Graygender - A weak or indeterminant nonbinary gender, or an individual who is not invested in their gender

Cassgender - A gender identity that one feels is unimportant, or someone who is indifferent to the idea of gender 

Bigender - Someone who is two genders at once, or has two distinct gender identities 

Trigender - Someone who is three genders at once, or has three distinct gender identities 

Polygender - Someone who has multiple/many genders at once 

Alterous - An attraction that is not entirely or completely platonic or romantic, and is best described as wanting emotional closeness without necessarily being platonic and/or romantic 

Queerplatonic - A relationship that is not romantic, but involves a close emotional connection beyond what most people consider friendship/best-friendship; there is also a commitment level similar to a romantic relationship, where people partner up, oftentimes for their whole lives, to go through life together. 

Quoioromantic - When someone experiences something between romantic and platonic attraction, but doesn’t know what romantic attraction feels like and doesn’t know if they experiences, or just can’t differentiate between the two

Polyamorous - When someone does not desire to be in a relationship with only one other person. This often applies to the LGBTQ+ community and LGBTQ+ people are often polyamorous, so it was included here (I also am inclined to just include the term in the general community anyway, but that’s Discourse™ so I’ll leave it at that). 

Hopefully that helps! 

[colorisbyshe]

Linking to this post where @officialcisblog​ and I were speaking. I’m creating a new post because it got too long.

@officialcisblog​ said:

Wow you completely ignored the fact that I stated asexuality and aromanticism challenges societal norms!

Also the fact that I’m aspec yeah, but I’m trans/nonbinary and not straight.

You leave out the fact that being asexual doesn’t mean a person is straight. But society has a huge pressure on people to BE overtly sexual and to WANT sex. Which, on one hand is okay, but on the other hand is toxic/harmful to not just ace people.

And trying to compare ace people to just normal straight people is sort of… gross. Asexuality is an identity within itself that has unique characteristics. It’s not comparable to “some person focusing on their career” because that person will probably still be sexually attracted to people and other things that a lot of asexual people wouldn’t. In fact, as an aspec person your blatantly WRONG explanation of asexuality is.. pretty offensive.

Asexual people still have sex. Some do, some don’t. A lot of times it’s just a lack of sexual attraction WHICH IS A FORM OF SEXUALITY.

Part of the LGBT community is that we challenge the norms of society. I mean, look at the drag movement- not the modern one, but the one that occurred during the Queer Revolution/LGBT movement in the 1970’s-90’s. Trans people like Marsha P. Johnson were put out into the spotlight.

Why? Because she challenged a part of society’s construct.

And please don’t act like the LGBT community is “SGA only” because A) you’re throwing bisexual, pansexual polysexual and so on people under the bus- wether it be people who are one of these labels but are primarily attracted to/currently in a relationship with their opposite gender (if they have one) or people who feel like SGA doesn’t fit them because they’re not just attracted to one gender. I mean last time I checked, me being pan doesn’t mean I’m attracted to my same gender. I’m attracted regardless of gender and I don’t want to get lumped in with being “SGA” because it’s not the same experience.

And B) if that was the case Straight trans people need to leave the community. Sorry y'all. Nonbinary people aren’t allowed either.  

((Not to mention the term itself, SGA, is a term which has roots in conversion therapy))

The aspec community is fighting towards having what a lot of others want- like nonbinary people, pan people, and other marginalised identities want.

To be seen. To be seen as more than just a joke or a freak. To educate people on our identities and what they are and what they mean to us. We fight for acceptance and awareness like a lot of the lesser-known marginalised identities of the LGBTQIA+ community do.

And yknow, the community is supposed to pride itself on diversity and acceptance. It’s a COMMUNITY. Shoving your head up your asshole and spending more time screeching about “SGA” people as if they’re superior to the rest of us kind of defeats the purpose, and honestly gets you nowhere. Aspecs aren’t doing any harm to the community by being apart of it, just like how bi/pan/poly people who are with their opposite gender and straight trans people aren’t causing any harm by just simply existing in the community.

I want to begin by saying, no, I’m not ignoring you saying that aromanticism/asexuality challenge societal norms. I’m saying they don’t challenge societal norms. Thanks.

Rest of my response under a read more:

I don’t know why you’re listing off your identities as if they’re relevant? No one in this thread said you can’t be ace, trans, and non-straight. We’re just saying that the cis and straight aces aren’t non-heteronormativie. Neither are cis aroaces. It’s... that simple. If you can be trans non-straight and ace, someone else can therefore be... cis straight and ace. Mind boggling concept, I know.

Society really doesn’t give a fuck if you want sex. Society just cares if you have sex and if the sex you have is the right sex (between two cishet people, typically intraracial, typically everyone involved has no visible disabilities, and it should be procreative unless it’s all about the man’s pleasure). And even then?? Society stops caring if you’re dating. No one looks at elderly couples and is like “ah, there’s a chance you’ve stopped having sex. Society frowns on this.”

So, like, cis straight aces are just as straight as straight non-aces. Especially when you remember, there are aces who have/want/enjoy sex and non-aces who don’t.  There are some people so sex-repulsed they consider that an integral part of their sexuality but would not call themselves ace. They’re still straight if they only want to date the “opposite” gender or are only attracted to the “opposite” gender. Every relationship you can have to sex/romance is incorporated under “straight” if you are solely attracted to the opposite gender. (This is an abstract you, I’m not saying you are straight.) Just like if you are only attracted to the same/similar gender, it does not matter how you are attracted to them or what you want to do with them, you are gay.

I have a question for you--how is a single woman who never wants to date and doesn’t have time for sex treated differently in society that a straight woman who doesn’t feel sexual attraction and doesn’t date? What does society do to differentiate these women? How does the latter woman challenge gender norms in a way the cishet non-ace woman doesn’t?

How do cishet  ace people who have sex challenge gender norms in a way that cishet non-ace people who have sex don’t?

Gender norms aren’t based on whether or not your behaviour is motivated by attraction or not Gender norms are just based on your behaviour, motivators be damned.

If aces can have/want/need sex, what about asexuality is inherently non-heteronormative? What norms are they challenging?

To address your Marsha P Johnson statement, a. fuck you for comparing cishet aces to bisexual trans women and b. did you forget the original post?? We’ve already talked about how transness and gayness are both gender nonconforming and that’s why our activism overlaps.

Where did anyone say the LGBT community is “SGA” only?

Pansexual means “attracted to every gender,” so like... if you aren’t attracted to your own gender... that’s not pan. The only exception being if you don’t have a gender because then... yeah... you can’t be attracted to your own gender. You don’t have one.

Straight trans people are hurt by homophobia and transphobia no shit they belong. We’re talking about cis straight aces and cis araoces. Why do y’all derail posts like this????

SGA doesn’t have roots in conversion therapy. It’s root is “attracted to the same gender” which is an extremely common phrase. It IS used in conversion therapy and it stems from SSA in that case. But it also comes from SGL which is AAVE. Again, same gender attraction is a very common phrase, so it has multiple “origins.”

The ace community A. Isn’t fighting for anything. Seriously can you name a single ace organization that does activism and B. Isn’t fighting for LGBT causes.

Visibility isn’t an LGBT issue. People know LGBT people exist. The LGBT community currently suffers from something called “hypervisibility.” We suffer because people know about us and use that to oppress us.

LGBT people aren’t fighting to not be seen as jokes/freaks. We’re fighting to exist in public and not have our love, lives, sex, bodies, health be legal. We’re fighting for legal protections which we don’t currently have. We’re fighting to not be killed, assaulted, abused, and rejected.

ANY social group can be said ot be fighting for the weak shit you’re listed. LGBT activism has specific goals. Yeah, if you decontextualize it, it sounds just like the ace community’s supposed goals!!

But AGAIN, fighting against coercive sex and romance is actually a FEMINIST issue, not an LGBT one!! In a world where LGBT people are killed for fucking and loving, our goals cannot be also reminding the world “yeah but sex and romance aren’t important.” LGBT people are literally forced into conversion therapy to make them sexless and loveless.

No, we don’t share goals with the ace community.

Aces aren’t doing harm to the community by being part of it. But cishet aces, cishet aros, and cis aroaces are. Because they oppress us.

Bisexuals and straight trans people don’t oppress the community. But thanks for comparing cishets to bisexuals and trans folk. Real nice.

Fuck off.