#obsessive (affectionate) thoughtful intelligent analyses of their favorite female charas' arcs and symbolism
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The way that my friend felt disappointed when he found out as a kid that an androgynous character he idolized was a woman because he quote "couldn't relate to the character anymore" and the way that the creator of Celeste """discovered he was non-binary""" because he wrote a female character that he was able to relate to are branches off of the same vein of misogyny I think
#gender critical#misogyny#it's all about the often-subconscious belief that women are subhuman or at least inherently lesser than men for being different from them#for the first dude: literally every woman on earth who consumes media relates to so fucking many male characters. they are our favorites.#some of them are so beloved by us that we believe we must actually be men because we can relate so hard to them. i went through this myself#(which is kind of what's going on with the second dude but i'll get to that)#yet for some reason a lot of men have a hard time relating to female characters in any way similar at all. there are zero men writing#obsessive (affectionate) thoughtful intelligent analyses of their favorite female charas' arcs and symbolism#(in part because so few media have any well-written and actually-humanized female charas to be able to do that with but also...)#because men see women as possibly-human fuck toys for them and nothing else#so when even self-proclaimed/usually feminist men relate to a female character outside of 'i want to fuck this' it makes them feel weird#bc male sexuality (this includes osa men i'm sorry to say but i've observed so many men like an anthropologist i see the same behavior#in all of them) is so centered around humilation/domination/aggression that it's not compatible with compassion/empathy#so for them to relate to a female (character or person) they get this weird-feeling psychological thing kinda similar to that joke of#'if you punch yourself and it hurts are you weak or strong?' but in this case it's 'if you relate to a sex object should you start thinking#you're also a sex object or should you let go of your momentary empathy for the sex object?'#and dude no. 1 took the latter path while dude no. 2 took the former#well in a way. his thing is more like 'if i am a human (bc i'm a man) and i can relate to a woman... does that mean women are human#or does it mean i am a woman?' and he picked the second route#i know agp vs hsts is (was?) the main grouping system radfems use(d?) to explain the different types of tims#and to some extent those labels do work especially since they're centered around sexuality which plays a huge role in trans identities#but i feel like it's either more accurate to just use the following labels or at least add them into the venn diagram:#some tims are trans because they see women as sex toys and enjoy the thought of being a sex toy themselves therefore they want to be women#while other tims are trans because they've othered the sex-object class of humans so hard that if they ever accidentally relate to a woman#it's a mindblowing discovery and makes them part of The Other (women are still of course treated as The Other for this to work) and#therefore super special (and of course more special than women because they're sex objects + The Other whereas#he is a man aka a human + The Other. this is especially true when men decide they're nb like guy no. 2 as opposed to trans women because#again women = sex toy to men so any men who do not want to be objectified are a different kind of Other to women [which to them consists of#females and trans women] but they still are The Other in some way and therefore must be both a man [human] and something else)#these concepts appeal to both osa and ssa men depending on what level/flavor of misogyny they cling to most and how gnc they are
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