#maybe mike is bi?

[mskingbean1989]

Definition of

Oh

𝘖𝘩. [🏳️‍🌈]

[i-eat-homeless-people]

guys guys hear me out

pan mike wheeler

[chirpsythismorning]

One of these day I’m gonna make a post that compiles all the evidence for gay, bi and unlabeled Mike that exists on the show bc ppl that deny any evidence whatsoever for one side or the other are hilarious to me.

[parkitaco]

maybe i am dumb maybe i’m smarter than everyone but i thought it was common knowledge that mike did not initially intend for the ‘it’s not my fault you don’t like girls’ comment to have gay implications

[mikesbasementbeets]

it’s a little frustrating sometimes to watch people try to “debunk” gay mike evidence by quibbling over things that are. kind of beside the point? like arguing that mike’s consistently negative (or even neutral, if you want the benefit of the doubt) reactions to girls aren’t “disgust” therefore they don’t mean anything. but like 1. yeah i agree, cates gate isn’t about mike being “disgusted.” mike’s face when el kisses him isn’t “disgusted.” mike’s reaction to el, to max, to girls in general doesn’t really read to me as “disgust” either. so 2. what DOES it read to you as? incredulity? confusion? discomfort? those…. still aren’t positive reactions.

the point is that mike actively and blatantly Does Not react positively toward el kissing him. and he also Doesn’t react positively to dustin’s description of a girl being “hotter than phoebe cates.” he asks “is she cute?” with maybe preemptive incredulity (in line with will's question "girls go to science camp?") over a girl who goes to science camp being cute, or perhaps just a neutrally curious state over dustin's new girlfriend, but then dustin doesn’t say “she’s hotter than phoebe cates.” he says, “think phoebe cates. only hotter.” that’s a prescriptive statement. you want to know if she’s cute, mike? think about phoebe cates, and then imagine someone hotter than that. and mike’s expression doesn’t improve in the slightest. think about someone hotter than phoebe cates, dustin tells mike. and mike? remains confused and entirely unintrigued. no, he’s not disgusted, but the point is not his negative reaction, it’s a complete lack of any sort of positive reaction. if he’s listening to dustin, he should have, in that moment, thought of phoebe cates. and his reaction?

nothing.

(but. this is also just to say... i don’t even think it's fair to call most of mike’s facial reactions “proof” of his sexuality in any argument… i think they’re fun little easter eggs that add an extra visual element to his gay characterization. but. it’s not WHY people think he’s gay. it's funny to point out BECAUSE he's gay)

[edit: AND this is not even to mention the direct line drawn to this in season four via stobin's discussion of fast times, linking phoebe cates to 'people who like boobies.' #notmikewheeler]

[mel-loly]

-Hello there! Hry'all?

A new character arrived! A somewhat exotic character, almost very different from the others I've already brought andd without further ado, her name is.... Sabryna! The butterfly bat :D

Sabryna look:

Description of her:

Name: Sabryna Morgan

Age: 27

Birthday: November 11th

Sexuality: Lesbian

Gender: Demigirl

Pronouns: She/They

Status: Dating with Celeste

Specie: Butterfly bat (a species of bat created by me-) <3

Personality: She likes to be “seen”, someone who attracts attention. She can sometimes be a little cocky but with whom she has more affinity, her rudeness become a great affection bomb, like- she literally goes from sour to sweet in a matter of minutes! <3

Dead/Alive: Alive

Family/relative: She does not have.

-Hope you guys have a wonderful day/night!💛

[gayofthefae]

Just dissociated into my GA persona again - one of the better/more accurate feeling times this time - and watched the van scene.

And I think it’s function is supposed to be for Mike to finally start to get it and get what’s going on with Will. It being about getting Will’s feelings across to the audience feels a lot more fourth-wall-break-y. If you’ve been paying attention, you already know based on all the lingering stares and lingering camera shots on them and his reactions even when he’s not doing them. His reactions to Mike have been really emphasized. But even so, it can serve both purposes: putting us and Mike in the same shoes. And there is no/minimal informational purpose of a scene that is just two characters being oblivious to each other when it doesn’t even cause a miscommunication. And within just volume 2, without knowledge of season 5 - which is, of course, how it is meant to be watched: chronologically - the implication is that this scene only exists to reaffirm Will’s feelings to the audience (an insufficient motive if it is has such little affect on the characters if you ask me) and to help give Mike the confidence to tell El he loves her. But if that was the only goal it would have been done without the emphasis on Will’s personal feelings. 

In the past, Mike’s said things and regretted them because he knew they hit on insecurities of Will’s and were just generally not super cool things to say and that’s why he felt bad. But he never knew Will’s specific or personal feelings before. Just inferred that it would hurt based on his knowledge of how Will’s been treated and Will’s immediate facial reaction.

But in this one, the entire scene, Mike is entranced. He’s listening to every word. I’ve said before that he avoids interrupting like he’s scared it’ll ruin it - treating it like new information that is fragilely and vulnerably being delivered to him unlike the claim that Will is just repeating it. The entire scene, Mike is entranced. He’s listening to every word. I’ve said before that he avoids interrupting like he’s scared it’ll ruin it - treating it like new information that is fragilely and vulnerably being delivered to him unlike the claim that Will is just repeating it. He’s gaining new information. And that would also be applicable to just the information about El - if it weren’t for the way he looks at Will. And I don’t just mean in a romantic sense. In fact, I mostly wouldn’t consider it one inherently. It’s more about the up and down looks - examining Will’s face - putting the focus on Will. How Will is saying it; what Will’s micro-expressions mean for the subtext of the information - as if how Will feels about the information has bearing on the information itself. Which wouldn’t be true unless Mike believes that Will is truly the one delivering it. 

He is invested in other conversations with Will. He has been the whole rest of the season. And many of them have been emotionally intimate in a similar positive way to this one. But he has always made steady eye contact with him. He has kept that mutual intimacy through eye contact. This time, he’s analyzing Will visually, looking all across his face for answers, he’s darting back to the painting every time El is mentioned...he’s having A LOT harder of a time processing this information. Will in the scene where he’s packing is a great example of being relieved by hearing something you want to hear that gives your confidence back after a fight. He does not break eye contact. He just takes in the moment. He lets it be until it’s interrupted externally. But Mike isn’t doing it. He’s almost looking like he wants to get out of it not to stop the flow of information but just to escape into his own head (which he seems to do in the end). Will is the one more invested in the actual conversation. At the end, he too wants to break off because he needs to cry in private. He wants to break off for a similar reason of being alone with himself to process everything. But while he is trying to juggle processing it emotionally, Mike is trying to juggle processing it logically. He doesn’t want the flow of information to stop. And he is entranced. His full attention is on Will. Even when he glances away, it’s only in a dash because he is holding his focus and taking everything in, trying not to miss anything, and taking it in emotionally - things like why Will pushed him away.

I’d also like it noted that before this, they were also having quite an intimate conversation! An emotional one about how Mike feels and his deep insecurities. Will hadn’t talked much during it but when he did, this was not how Mike treated it. He didn’t treat it as morsels of invaluable information. He treated it like a normal response in a conversation. And yes, Will’s speech is more important information but still. During the speech, his faces aren’t so ambiguous for the audience. No good art is truly created for its audience. The characters in this have motives. Just like we may be placed in his shoes with Will even for those who knew to have confirmation, we are being placed in his here as well. It is ambiguous because he is confused. He doesn’t know how to react internally. He’s still just taking it all in trying not to miss anything vital.

Will’s words aren’t romantic. But the fact that he passes them off as Will’s is. And the fact that he would feel the need to hide them at all is too. Mike knows this. And he doesn’t know what to do with it. And he doesn’t know what to do with the fact that he doesn’t know what to do with it. Because one fact ABOUT not knowing what to do with it is that he doesn’t immediately know. He doesn’t immediately reject the idea mentally. He doesn’t KNOW that the answer is no - even a kind no. A mental “no” is fairly immediately. You just know these things. Of course, this is all just speculation. The entire point is that Mike’s face is unreadable from his confusion. We don’t GET any reactions from him. That’s. the point.

Until the end. He only responds one time, one word. And it’s to look for confirmation. It seems like a close to the information he’s getting: a concluding statement; an answer to his previous words. So he speaks for the first time. “Yeah?” “Yeah.” 

And he’s happy.

HE’S HAPPY with this. He isn’t still confused - I’m sure he is still processing, he goes back to the painting immediately after and continues looking over it (providing motive to look back up at Will, preoccupied enough to not notice Will is crying when looking back up at him, and/or see it and not be able to emotionally or decide he can’t situationally help). But his emotions are visible here. If we’re meant to be seeing Will’s feelings here. And we’re meant to have seen nothing from Mike indicating feelings for Will previous to this. The information we get is still clear: Will has feelings for Mike. And Mike is happy.

I don’t think it was delivered this way so that Mike doesn’t know about Will’s feelings. I think it was delivered this way so that Will doesn’t know that Mike knows.

And this also indicates to me that Mike didn’t know before this. About any of it. We know from an interview with Finn Wolfhard that Mike was, as of Vol 1 to note, completely oblivious. I am applying this to his own feelings as well. One can act in reaction to their feelings without being consciously aware of them. Mike’s reactions in the van scene are almost universally to himself. You don’t do that that much unless you have A LOT to say to yourself. And you don’t have that much to say to yourself if you’ve already had time to think on your own feelings - even if you have a lot of very confusing feelings. No, Mike is grappling with the concept itself. I don’t know that he has logically come to a conclusion by the end of it - in fact he probably hasn’t - but he does have an immediate emotional reaction upon coded confirmation. 

And this gives Mike time. He knows what Will feels now, so he confirms within Will’s code. He doesn’t ask “do you agree”, he keeps Will safe in his code. But he can clearly see and hear the emotion in the way Will answers. That’s the confirmation he needed. And this way, he keeps Will in the dark about him knowing. He gives himself time to sort it all out. And I’m not analyzing the reasons he does what he later does right now but I will say I know this: he does it in an effort to sort it out. Whether that be just to do what he has to in the moment or out of suppression. And I can also say that when Will telling him to tell El he loves her seems to hurt him. Right now, I don’t think because he takes it as a rejection, but rather because he understands more than we give him credit for. He understands what Will is sacrificing. That Will is hurting himself. He might have thought during the van scene that it was meant as a coded confession. A confession with a fallback plan. But now he sees that it wasn’t. That it was actually a secret always meant to stay a secret. That Will’s confession wasn’t him dipping his toe in the water. It was him being as self-indulgent as he would ever allow himself to be.

So now the ball is in Mike’s court. And he knows it. And he already bought himself as much time as he needs. There are loads of other factors including how he takes��much of the information covered and not in this post. Who knows if he takes Will’s self-sacrifice as an invitation or a rejection, for example. But ultimately: Mike is the only one who can make a move, he is on his own time to do it, and he knows it. Now it’s just up to what he’ll do with that information.

a little analysis backtracking into s1-3 to explain his oblivion in the tags

[exsqueezememacaroni]

i was 21 and he was 19? i dunno, I came back from study abroad and here was this hyper puppy that wanted wax dripped on his nipples, what was I supposed to do?!?!

[bethhiraeth]

The pipeline of Mike's straight poor Will:( -> lol you know what? what if Mike is actually bi and he likes Will lamo -> wait is Mike actually gay? -> Mike is the gayest person I have ever seen

[mskingbean1989]

They could never make me hate you Mike Wheeler.

[cringengl]

Idc I want either Will, Mike or Robin to say the words:

"I'm gay"

In s5. Enough skirting around it and being vague and sort of hinting at it, someone should actually say it. The fact that Will had to be confirmed to be gay by Noah Schnapp and the Duffers because so many people didn't understand what the van scene/pizza scene with Jonathan was about was kind of annoying.

Although I understand why these characters haven't said it before, it's the 80s and Will of course was lying to Mike in the van scene and was in the pizza parlour with other people, not just Jonathan, and Robin was half high off truth serum whilst talking to a guy from highschool that she used to dislike.

As someone who has struggled with saying their sexuality out loud and has come out many times by just confirming people's already existing ideas, I think it would be a really cool acceptance moment for the character, to actually say it out loud, and canon confirmation that no one could deny.

[finnickodaiir]

You all (ST fans) now arguing about swifitie headcanons of fictional characters... please go outside

[dilemmaed]

"if you don't like bi mike you're biphobic" or maybe im a bi person who thinks he's gay? 😭 god this fanbase is fucking wild

[reikunrei]

unlabeled queer mike wheeler is actually something that can be so personal

[paintingformike]

feeling so weirdly uncomfy about this fic that made will date a girl...

[infiniteglitterfall]

Honestly, what does "hasn't been born yet" even mean for a time traveler. That they haven't been born yet in whatever time they're visiting? Or that Susan herself had been born in his personal future and went off traveling with his first(??) self? The latter is more interesting, at least.

In that case, it could mean he had been a father before, but not to Susan's parent, and was still going to be again.

Or yeah they could just mess up. Moffat was extremely big on just saying and doing whatever was most interesting at the moment, and abandoning it the moment it became inconvenient to him personally. But that's not the norm anymore - I hope.

People who have seen under 20 years of Doctor Who: Aw I can't believe they teased the Doctor's family but we didn't learn anything

People who have seen Too Much Doctor Who: THEY CONFIRMED SUSAN'S PARENT HASN'T BEEN BORN YET?? FINALLY A SIGNIFICANT UPDATE!! WE ARE MAKING REAL PROGRESS!!