#critical fan fiction
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i donât mind suspending my disbelief for leverageâs person-sized ventilation shafts bc thatâs pretty standard for the genre, but that doesnât mean i wonât laugh a bit at some of the egregiously large vents. particularly in the crowning acheivement job (lev: red s2 finale) because - well just look at this lol! harry and parker, two adults, can kneel side by side in those vents. parker can sit upright.
that museum was made for vent crawling purposes. thatâs just an extra room in the museum they forgot to decorate. the leverageverse has a thief union that successfully lobbied for a better working environment. these vents double as a playground for museum-goersâ children. i was crying with laughter thinking about this and harryâs vent crisis was NOT helping me remember that there was a serious heist thing going on lol, i love this show.
#leverage redemption#leverage#parker leverage#harry wilson#harry wilson leverage#parker#wren speaks#leverageposting#the sun roofs (or are they just lights?) really get me lmao#ALL of the person-sized vents are unrealistically large so this is not criticism! this is a generic convention!#vents are not human-sized and clean or remotely safe enough to reliably crawl through irl#but basically every building in every crime drama has comfortably person-sized vents#usually for knee crawling not even people lying on their stomach bc thatâs difficult to move and looks sillier#and that thin layer of the ceiling under the vent is usually surprisingly built well enough to support a persons weight#and thereâs no fans or rats or dust or bugs or that foil tube stuff i forgot the word for#and itâs often oddly well-lit. and thatâs okay! itâs fiction! weâre having fun!#sewers tend to be unrealistically large + accessible + well-lit etc in fiction too.#anyway my point is iâm not saying this as criticism! just a neutral obserativion of something i found funny!
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all comic fans know how to do is: develop superiority complexes based on their personal perceptions of a character, eat hot chip, and lie
#we are all posting on a half-dead hellsite about a handful of fictional superheroes#who are all written by various creators with different interpretations and biases#and who are all employed by a soulless corporation who values the quantity of comics they sell over the quality of stories they tell#nobody here is winning#so stop feeding your ego by looking down on how other people find comfort in characters#so long as their fan content does not cause tangible harm#get a grip#discourse and media criticism is one thing#unnecessary negativity is something entirely apart#batman#batfam#jason todd#dick grayson#cassandra cain#talia al ghul#bruce wayne#red hood#nightwing#red robin#tim drake#spoiler#stephanie brown#black bat#duke thomas#the signal#dc comics#dc fans
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The more I think about it, the more I question Arcane S2's politics and themes, which were so foundational to S1. Like, a tiny example [SPOILERS AHEAD]:
Singed wins. He gets exactly what he wants in the end. All his "efforts" are rewarded. What does that say about people who share his ideology of eugenics? He is the source of nearly every horrible thing and conflict that happened (Shimmer, the factory deaths, Jinx, Vander as Warwick, the corruption of Viktor), and he gets a happier ending than any other character. Not even a 'he got what he wanted but he has become completely unrecognizable/monstrous to his daughter' tag at the end. You can say they're setting him up and need to open his daughter to future shows, but the way you end a character's story says something about what you think about that character. What does it say when the eugenicist war criminal gets the happy ending he doesn't deserve?
#personal#delete later#and you can say âit's not that deep it's just what makes sense to end his characterâ but lets not kid ourselves#this past month people have been chattering about microexpressions in animation or metaphors and symbolism in interactions#and random props and set details. the end of a character's arc MEANS something thematically.#and it just feels offputting that the most unforgivable character wins while everyone else is dead or suffers alone#and don't give me that âsometimes the bad guy winsâ look this is an extreme lol.#i would be fine with this outcome for singed if literally EVERY other character wasn't suffering. only singed got what he wanted#honestly fans who have been completely unwilling to consider negative analysis and criticisms of arcane annoy me so much#y'all chirp about how amazing it is that arcane is so political until the politics get weird. then it's a completely apolitical show#specifically the final âdirt under you fingernailsâ line. that felt so weird and offputting coming from vi#a part of this is definitely just reactionary anger at a fictional character. like. you caused untold amounts of suffering and agony#all for your daughter. fuck you you don't get your daughter
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Hey fanfiction loving friend!
AO3 has the ability to turn off comments, moderate comments, restrict comments to logged in users only, or let anyone comment on your story. Most other fanfiction hosting websites do not allow comments to be turned off and in the case of some (wattpad) highly encourage comments even on individual paragraphs.
Over on reddit, someone said it is an unwritten rule of fanfiction that you should never leave a negative or critical comment on a story. This was countered most strongly by many arguments. Despite many people asserting that their stance was the one truth and that there was no debate on the topic - there was a lot of debate about what criticism even is and where the line should be for if giving concrit is alright.
So give this some thought:
If you have tea to spill, examples or an argument you want to make, please do. I have some that go both ways, but I'm going to wait for a few responses so I don't pre-empt the results. I'm not going to vote myself for a while, either, so I won't know which way the poll is leaning when I do pour my tea. I tried to cover all the flavors of debate I've seen in the many "definitive" posts I have read here and on reddit. Please reblog for a wider sample!
#fanfiction discourse#fan fiction#fanfiction#fan work#fan etiquette#commentary#fanfiction.net#ao3 author#ao3 reader#ao3feed#ao3#wattpad comments#comments on fanfic#looking for constructive criticism#constructive criticism#concrit welcome#concrit not welcome#concrit
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Whump: A Shadowgast Rec List
This week, we have whump! Check under the cut for 16 fics featuring all sorts of hurt just in time for whumptober, and don't forget to comment and kudos if you like them!
Stronger together by Bob fish & enemytosleep (11000, Teen) Reccer's Content Notes: Graphic Depictions of Violence
Essek joins tm9 on an adventure ⊠and his inexperience shows.
Reccer says: The outsiderâs view of tm9 is fun, and it does a great job of exploring Essekâs struggles at this stage of the campaign. Bonus points for happy Caleb.
The Fullness of Time by Cers (162.788, Teen) Reccer's Content Notes: Choose Not to Warn
Caleb and Essek travel through time after narrowly escaping death in aeor. Their journey has unexpected consequences and Essek ends up trapped between timelines, facing a fate worse than death.
Reccer says: Just when you think everything is fine and all challenges have been overcome, this story hits you with a mean left hook. 10/10 would sob my heart out again
it's strange what desire will make foolish people do by GammaRey (3479, General) Reccer's Content Notes: No Content Notes
Essek gets injured after the Lucien fight and Caleb takes care of him
Reccer says: short and sweet!
proof by contradiction by Chrome (19620, Teen) Reccer's Content Notes: Graphic Depictions of Violence
Beauregard asks for Dairon's help freeing a friend held captive by the Cerberus Assembly. They and Essek work together to escape.
Reccer says: A wonderful look into Dairon's character and perspective. The glimpsed she sees of the Nein's relationships with Essek are so wonderful. I find myself rereading the ending in paticular over and over again. Though shadowgast is not the focus of the fic, what we see of it has definitely inspired how i view their relationship to outsiders.
The Mind and The Malady by SaltCore (38945, Teen) Reccer's Content Notes: Graphic Depictions of Violence
Essek has to endure the Aeor delve with the Mighty Nein whilst suffering from hanahaki.
Reccer says: A classic amongst Shadowgast fics, honestly. All of it is so good, but I'm particularly fond of the in-universe explanation for Exandrian hanahaki and I still think about Caleb and Essek's conversation at the end of the fic all the time.
some things time can't fix by Chrome (25930, Mature) Reccer's Content Notes: None
Daemon AU - Essek is arrested for treason. The Dynasty severs the daemons of prisoners before executing them so they canât be reborn.
Reccer says: Oh man there is so much emotion packed in. The world we see is fascinating, and it is such a painful ride seeing the development of Essekâs situation.
as if through a prism by wanderinghooves (30812, General) Reccer's Content Notes: No Content Notes
Essek and Caleb have a terrible time in Aeor.
Reccer says: Incredible character study, very well written. I Very strongly recommend it!
Slow In The Tide by SaltCore (3853, Teen) Reccer's Content Notes: Drowning
Essek makes a decision during a fight with Uk'atoa's minions. Essek doesn't know how to swim.
Reccer says: I liked it!
bow shock by SaltCore (4615, Mature) Reccer's Content Notes: Graphic Depictions of Violence
Caleb is attacked by a Volstrucker. Essek rescues him.
Reccer says: Essekâs ruthlessness is extremely my jam.
Mourning Sun and Falling Star by LuckyOwlsFoot (21338, Mature) Reccer's Content Notes: Major Character Death, Graphic Depictions of Violence
A whumptastic time in Aeor, part 2.
Reccer says: These cursed ruins can fit so much hurt/comfort in them.
heliopause by SaltCore (5035, Mature) Reccer's Content Notes: Graphic Depictions of Violence
Essek is attacked by Dynasty assassins. Caleb rescues him.
Reccer says: A lot of evocative details and a hopeful ending.
Crush by flashhwing (3672, Mature) Reccer's Content Notes: Choose Not to Warn, Serious Injury, Light Suffocation, Temporary Paralysis
While in Aeor, the wizards get caught in a tunnel collapse. Essek is able to avoid getting trapped, but Caleb isn't so lucky.
Reccer says: The way spacing is utilized is fantastic for building the atmosphere of the fic and showcasing just how long Caleb spends trapped. The Sendings and dynamic between Caleb and Essek are so delicious, just top-tier hurt/comfort with heavy emphasis on the hurt.
all that it took (for the dream to break) by neinofthem (greekphilosophress) (1851, Mature) Reccer's Content Notes: Graphic Depictions of Violence
essek in the Dungeon, slowly taken apart physically and mentally
Reccer says: Makes me cry every time. Short but packed with emotion.
Hold Me Close, Cut Me Deep by CatgirlTheCrazy (14192, Mature) Reccer's Content Notes: No Content Notes
Essek stumbles across a dangerous entity in Aeor that takes the form of Caleb. Obviously, terrible things ensue and they are forced to make some difficult decisions.
Reccer says: The pre-relationship pining, inadvertently severely injuring each other and the resulting guilt from that, having to make life or death decisions that deeply affect their relationship, incubi, very nice recovery feels with some hurt/comfort. What more could you ask for?
Reports of my safety have been greatly exaggerated by ghosttopiary (59343, General) Reccer's Content Notes: Graphic Depictions of Violence
Ludinus kidnaps Essek to use him as bait to trap the Nein. Essek refuses to comply.
Reccer says: lotta hurt lotta comfort
The following fic received two recs!
Tomb of Rust by LuckyOwlsFoot (23682, Mature) Reccer's Content Notes: Graphic Depictions of Violence, Strangulation, Drowning, PTSD and Panic Attacks, Serious Injury
The wizards go to Aeor and things go far worse than they could've possibly imagined.
Reccer 1 says: These cursed ruins can fit so much hurt/comfort in them. Reccer 2 says: There are several scenes from this fic and its sequel that will haunt me until the day I die and I mean that in the most complimentary sense. Everything that could go wrong for the wizards does and in many ways you will not expect going into the fic. Excellent whump, excellent plot twists and developments, and also excellent moments of comfort between Caleb and Essek in the midst of all their suffering!
This is one of our weekly communally-generated shadowgast rec lists. Every week we announce a new theme and allow anyone to submit a fic recommendation.Â
And hey, anyone includes you!
Next week, we'll be featuring fics that include or feature cultural differences! Big or small, they can both be sweet or lead to confusion. Either way, it makes for wonderful fics
Any fics coming to mind? Well, then use this form to submit!
#shadowgast#caleb widogast#essek thelyss#critical role#cr fic recs#fan fiction rec list#critical role fan fiction#cr fic#cr fics#whump
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reading the dunmeshi manga really makes u realize how inherently awful the perspective on ryoko kui's world building is in anime only fans. like if youre a fan of the anime and wanna have a well rounded and functionally accurate view of this work I really recommend swallowing ur pride and reading the manga, it gives a lot of perspective that's missed in anime form. at least in my opinion/experience (genuine)
#not to shame anyone. just really its helpful as someone who wants to be a well-read fan who can think critically about things in fiction#and all the chilchuck discourse is jusy đđ i can tell most of these people habe no idea what theyre talking about#the manga js just so..so good. it can not be overrated enough#dunmeshi#dungeon meshi#delicious in dungeon
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On the one hand Ashton hates and distrusts authority figures because most of the ones heâs known (with a handful of notable exceptions since meeting Bellâs Hells) have been assholes who have used and/or hurt them.
On the other hand, down deep (or maybe not so deep, really) Ashton is still the orphaned child constantly searching for a parentâs love and approval.
If the Bright Queen ever figures that out, sheâs going to be able to manipulate them into doing whatever she wants. Forget having to have Chet or a bounty hunter deliver Ash to her, heâll walk into that gilded cage willingly. Add into the bargain the chance to understand themselves better and no longer be a risk to the people he cares about? Theyâd be lost before they even realized theyâd given away their freedom.
Assuming they all survive the upcoming missions, Bellâs Hells should start working on their rescue plans asap. Luckily, theyâre about to meet a crew of adventurers who might have some useful advice for them.
#critical role#bells hells#critical role spoilers#c3e105#the bright queen#ashton greymoore#to be clear I love this turn of events#I am beyond ready for Ashtonâs genasi in distress era#I canât wait for the fan fiction#I might even write some myself
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"She wasn't like everyone else, she was- she was musical in a way that i'd never seen before."
#critical role#critical role campaign 3#bells hells#critters#critical role fanart#laudna#fanart#imogen temult#imodna#imogen x laudna#I despratly need someone to make fan fiction of this omg#I saw one story that had imogen as a singer instead but Laudna would fucking rock a stage
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I think the reason I prefer wincest spaces over destiel spaces even though I do enjoy both ships boils down to an average difference in approach when it comes to canon v fanon. Cesties tend to operate in a realm of suspended disbelief. Most just do not care if itâs a canon thing, if itâs widely accepted to be true, or even if itâs liked by the majority of fans. They just enjoy the ship for the expansion that it is and what text is given in show. Ofc they do care about canon wincest, but itâs just not the Focus because we know the brothers and their relationship (romantic or not) will always be the core of spn. Hellers on the other hand have this incessant need to Prove that their ship is realâthat Dean and cas are canonically in a reciprocal, non-platonic love, and that itâs an undeniable Fact Of Canon. Itâs unfathomable how anyone could watch the show and not see what they see. Itâs less fun in my opinion
#Iâm not saying tht wincest fans canât also be delusional and proof obsessed#but itâs just not as common#they tend to stay in their lane and focus on creating pockets of fiction within fiction#does this make sense?#j2 tinhats are not included in this analysis#wincest#samdean#destiel critical
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people, âfansâ, attacking an actor on twitter because his views of a character and wishes for him donât align with theirs, calling him names, mocking him for his hairstyle, starting tag-wars and begging for a ship to become canon and Iâm honestly speechless.
criticizing creative decisions for a character, wonky storylines, questionably written female characters and plotholes is good and fair - but only if it happens on a factual and grounded basis which is absolutely not the case here.
we, as fans, should never feel entitled to how a storyâs gonna play out - never, ever, ever. we can voice our sadness, share our stories and opinions, but we are not entitled to see the story play out exactly how we want it to. Never ever ever.
I donât know if yâall remember the marketing of The Last of Us Part II, the switched out trailer, indicating Joel is alive when in fact he dies about half an hour into the game - now THAT was hard as fuck as well, but nobody screamed or lost their minds about âfalse marketing.â Because guess what marketing is?
A story is a story, and once you stop enjoying it, itâs absolutely your right to tune out of it and to look for your enjoyment elsewhere and pour your passion into anything else - but itâs never your right to harass people and to ruin the experience for everybody else.
#Norman Reedus#the walking dead#fans#fandom#once heâs done playing Daryl because of yâall then what?#please stop yâall#itâs okay to be mad and sad and to criticize the show but not over a fictional ship#the last of us#joel miller#marketing#daryl dixon#personal#twd#NR#the book of carol#tboc#twd spoilers
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I was skimming through my old Soukoku fics and LMAO Chuuya chill out
#looking back i have some issues with my characterization#like my fics had a lot of good analysis and introspection but when it came to action an dialogue dazai wasnât always dazaiing#iâm still proud of the way i wrote most of the other characters tho#excluding some of theâŠummâŠfics where i had to take creative liberties lol#iâve been warming up to skk again lately so maybe someday iâll attempt to write the worldâs first in character skk fic#not to toot my own horn but if anyone could do it i could#i will forever love the way i wrote chuuya tho#i feel like you can see traces of him in how i write kou#with obvious differences bcuz my characterization improved a lot with tbhk#i try not to be overly harsh on my own fics but i am v critical when i reread so i have to remember to pat myself on the back too#analyze both my strong and weak points yk#bsd#bungou stray dogs#soukoku#skk#osamu dazai#chuuya nakahara#fanfic#fan fiction#ao3#archive of our own
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I really wanted to ask you about this:
Do you have any advice of how to develop critical thinking and media literacy?
There are many, many ways you can practice critical thinking, evaluation and media literacy. At its most basic, you can access student resources for lower levels of education like earlier high school years and look at the examples and guidance given there. Rehashing this will often give you a good foundation to build off of and apply.
One of the main aspects of critical thinking involves discerning what is fact and what is opinion. A good portion of media analytics is opinion. What is 'bad' by one person's standards is 'sub-par' or even 'great' by another's. Similarly, the majority of fandom space is opinion-based. The main pitfall of fandom spaces is that everyone wants their opinion to be taken as fact, which is where critical thinking and even basic communication begin to fall away.
"I'm right and you're wrong" and "this is the way it should be, if you do it or think differently, you're wrong" are common roadblocks people run into when engaging with things like media analysis and even basic fandom activities like fanfiction.
'Mischaracterisation' is fanfiction is one popular topic, especially here on Tumblr. What people often fail to recognize is the true creative depth of fanfiction and using someone else's pre-existing characters. Characters as they are in the source material may not make the choices or behave in the ways necessary to activate or validate certain plot material or author intentions in fanfiction. Which is, inherently, one of the main points of fanfiction. Exploring the alternate.
While you might immediately recoil and say "he'd never do that!" you then have to sit back and recognise that that's exactly the point. That this iteration of that character is not meant to directly reflect the source material. Its a re-imagining, a re-interpretation. That doesn't mean its bad. Its simply different.
'Mischaracterisation' is only actually applicable in fandom spaces when someone is trying to insist as a blanket fact that a character would do something or behave in a way that blatantly contradicts their canon behavior, opinions, morals and perspective or deliberately interpreting an action in biased bad faith. It is not actually applicable to fanfiction where creative liberty dictates you can do whatever the fuck you want with a character because you're not trying to claim it as part of the source content.
Questions To Ask Yourself
Am I reacting to [media] emotionally instead of rationally? Is my emotional response to [media] blinding me to the rational or critical approach(es)?
Am I allowing my expectations to get in the way of me understanding [media] fully? Am I forming a biased negative opinion of [media] because it isn't meeting my expectations?
Even if I disagree with [media], do I actually understand it? Can I recognise the reasoning behind choices made or actions even if I don't agree with them?
Am I searching too hard to hidden meaning or purpose in absolutely everything? Can I recognise what is simply passive information/detail and what is active information/detail? (E.g; English tutors saying a character's curtains are blue because they're depressed when throughout the literature its passively reinforced that blue is the character's favorite color.)
Even though I disagree with the statement or opinion shown, is it necessary to argue against it? Is there any benefit to making my counter-opinion known or is it simply a no-end argument? Am I just using arguing as a means of release/fulfilment? Am I treating this person poorly because of their opinion/statement?
Resources
Critical Thinking Exercises & Explanations #1 The Critical Thinking Activity Workbook Early Stage Critical Thinking Games Five Media Literacy Activities Six Media Literacy Ideas
#myfandomrealitea#sephiroth speaks#fandom#reality#fanfiction#fanfic#fan fic#literature#media literacy#critical thinking#education#fandom culture#activities#games#fiction#ao3
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#fanfic#fanfiction#fan fic#fic#fan fiction#archive of our own#ao3#wattpad#fanfiction.net#ff.net#poll#polls#some fandoms to get this attention (will delete tags after poll ends):#batman#atla#9 1 1#pokemon#critical role#ever after high#fallout#hazbin hotel#good omens#merlin#rise of the teenage mutant ninja turtles#danny phantom#hannibal#miraculous ladybug#avatar the last airbender#dungeon meshi#dunmeshi
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Nothing makes me happier than watching @quiddie be not only a girlâs girl⊠but a FANgirlâs girl
#her fan fiction reading monster fucker ass is SO there for us#always asking the REAL QUESTIONS#critical role#cr c3#four sided dive#crown keepers#bells hells#aabria iyengar
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Sorry if this seems confrontational, but for the life of me I canât get into your âChloe has no growthâ point when the show itself retracts growth from everyone and is inconsistent with everyone. You saying âThe show just lays down basic character traits in Chloeâ doesnât make sense when her basic character traits are supposed to be her being selfish and spoiled.
S2 built off of that and despite what you say, had Chloe doing things that in S1 she wouldnât have done. She apologized multiple times to the people she wronged, she willingly put herself in harmâs way to help the people she cares about and she was openly vulnerable to Ladybug in âMalidiktaorâ. Something S1 Chloe wouldnât have done. If thereâs a distinct difference between a Chloe back in S1 and a Chloe in S2, then growth HAS taken place. But it doesnât stay because of the formula (and the writers just donât want her to keep that growth)
So what Iâm asking isâŠwhat do you mean âChloe doesnât have growthâ?
I can understand the âNo arcâ argument because an unfinished arc feels like thereâs no arc at all (even though they are fundamentally not the same)
I wouldn't say that the show retracts growth from everyone. It's more that no one is ever supposed to grow. Every episode resets the cast. That's just how pure formula shows work and Miraculous is being sold as a pure formula show. The characters are meant to be static (one of the writers literally compared Miraculous to Dora the Explorer).
That static nature is why pure formula shows normally avoid giving their good-guy characters major flaws. It's the wrong medium for that type of thing specifically because the characters cannot change in meaningful ways throughout the show. They can learn little lessons that don't really change them and maybe have big change between seasons via a special or movie, but that's about it. Thus things like the season four conflict working so poorly. It's just a terrible choice for a formula show! The conflict is literally not allowed to develop properly because of the chosen format.
But sure, let's talk about Chloe and why I will die on the hill that she never demonstrated meaningful improvement even with the issue of the inconstant writing. In fact, seasons-one-to-three Chloe is one of the most consistent characters in the show. For this discussion to work, we need to start off by discussing character development and the two main forms it can take: character establishment and character growth.
Character Establishment
When the audience meets a character, they know nothing about said character. It's up to the writer to guide the introduction process. To choose when to reveal already existing elements of the character's personality, skills, and backstory. This is called character establishment. It is the writing telling you who the character is on a baseline level. Those reveals don't need to happen at the start of the story, though. They can be - and often are - held back for when the time is right.
When these reveals are delayed, it's important to remember that these elements were always part of the character. The reveal isn't changing who the character actually is. It's just changing how the audience views the character.
For example, we spend a good chunk of season one uncertain why Gabriel is doing what he does. Then, in Origins, we learn that it's all for Emilie. This is new information that adds depth to Gabriel's character, but it doesn't change him in any way. This is who he always was. We just know him better now and can recontextualize past events with our new understanding of his motivation.
Character Growth
Character growth is when writers take a character's personality or world view or even just their skills from point A to point B, allowing the audience to watch the character change and become a new better - or lesser - version of themself. This is usually part of a larger character arc where all the moments of growth add up, but it can take the form of small moments of growth that don't fit into a bigger picture, too. I'd probably still call that an arc, but we'll use the word "growth" a lot in this post, so let's just call it growth to be consistent.
Miraculous doesn't really have either arcs or growth because - once again - formula shows don't allow characters to meaningfully change, so I'm going to have to make up an example here. I'll use one that illustrates how character establishment and character growth can and do intertwine as that's an important thing to acknowledge to help guide this discussion.
Let's say that we have a character who lost their family at a young age. We'll call this character Mary. Mary's loss guides her character throughout the entire story, but the other characters and the audience are never told that this is what's going on. We just know that Mary acts in seemingly illogical ways at times and that she trusts no one.
Throughout the story, Mary learns to trust her costars, leading to a big, dramatic scene where she finally tells them - and the audience - about her past. This big dramatic scene is both the culmination of a character arc and a piece of baseline character establishment that allows us to understand Mary's character better no matter what part of the story we're reading.
Because these combo growth and establishment moments are so common in stories, it can feel like character growth when we learn new things about a character in a dramatic moment, but that's not always what's happening. Sometimes dramatic moments are just there to reveal what was always there by forcing a character to act differently than they usually do through the power of extenuating circumstances. These extenuating-circumstances moments are not character growth because, once the moment is over, the character resets to their normal self. The moment wasn't there to let them grow. It was there for the sake of the plot.
This is actually a really important thing that writers need to know how to do. Figuring out what circumstances will make a character say or do a thing they generally wouldn't say or do is part of how stories work. I have started stories with characters acting wildly "out of character" because I put them in the a situation where the behavior suddenly was in character!
Oh, you don't want to talk to this total stranger because you're an introvert with social anxiety who has yet to learn how to love yourself and open up to others? That's nice. Your leg is broken now and you're stuck in the middle of nowhere. What you gonna do sucker? Lie there in the dirt or talk to the nice lady who wants to help you? Your choice! (Spoiler: he talked to the nice lady. He even let her physically support him when he'd usually never let a stranger touch him!)
As soon as that scene was over, the character reverted because it wasn't growth. He didn't become a more open person. He just did something he normally wouldn't do because the situation demanded it. It was extenuating circumstances so that the freaking plot could start.
This is what happened with Chloe in season two. Everything that people call growth is really just extenuating circumstances that reset by the end of the episode or even by the end of the scene.
Let's Talk About Chloe
Chloe does not have a character arc, aborted or otherwise. She is never taken on a journey where we watch her change. All we get is delayed character establishment via extenuating circumstances, but it's given in ways that make some people feel like she was being given an arc. Let's talk about why that is.
Season one Chloe is a one dimensional mean girl. She has almost no depth. She's just here to be petty and cause akumas. She is not a fully realized character.
Season two takes those traits and keeps them, but also gives Chloe a lot more depth to round her out and make her feel like a real character. She's just as petty and mean as she always was, but we're finally allowed to see her in some moments that make her feel like a well of potential to become something more, which the writers basically had to do if they wanted to let her be a hero. The audience needed to feel like Chloe could be good in the right situation.
The feelings evoked by her newly discovered depth are why people go "oh, she had a character arc! My feelings about her changed in a big way!" But she didn't have an arc. You just got to know her better by seeing her in moments where she was forced to be vulnerable. That's not growth. Growth is meaningful, lasting change, not situational change. Everyone changes based on the situation! It's why the "True Selves" stuff is such nonsense. It implies that there's one set way that we're supposed to act in order to be authentic and anything else is some kind of lie which just isn't how the world works.
Let's look at some examples to drive home what I mean.
Season one established that Chloe idolized Ladybug. It's why we get things like this moment from Evil Illustrator:
Ladybug: Fine! You stay! Later! Cat Noir: What do you mean later? Ladybug: I mean, you're the one who wants to protect her, so you don't need me. So, later! (swings away) Chloé:(looks over balcony) Ahhh! Ladybug! Text me! OK!
And this confession from Antibug:
Ladybug:Â [Chloe] pretended she was me?! How often does that happen? Armand:Â She idolizes you.
So Chloe adores Ladybug and wants to impress her/be her best friend. Cool. Got it. That never goes anywhere in season one because season one doesn't see Chloe and Ladybug interact much. The most we get is Ladybug saving Chloe from akumas, which doesn't allow for deep conversations. I don't think that they're ever alone in a moment where they can actually talk.
That changes in season two. In season two, they get to interact a lot and it's often in moments where there's a big threat and no one else is around, letting us see a new side to Chloe. But that's not Chloe changing. It's just the writers revealing that Chloe has more to her than the mean girl stuff because of course she does! Pure mean girls don't exist. Everyone has depth. We simply never saw that depth before because Chloe was never put in a situation where she needed to be open. We can't say that season one Chloe wouldn't confess things to Ladybug or chose to sacrifice herself to let Ladybug win because she never had the chance to do those things!
In fact, I'd go so far as to argue that season one Chloe probably would have done the same things as season two Chloe because season two Chloe doesn't really contradict season one Chloe. Antibug showed us that Chloe was pretty desperate to be loved and welcomed the way that Ladybug is loved and welcomed:
Chloé: Jagged Stone! Jagged: (thinking she's the actual Ladybug) Ladybug! What are you doing here? Chloé: Um⊠when I find out you were here, I knew you'd wanna see me! I had to come say hello. (Sabrina waves at Jagged)
and Chloe has always been a stubborn girl who stands up for what she wants even if what she wants is something bad. Antibug also showed us that Chloe can be genuinely nice to the people she cares about. Her and Sabrina's relationship is shown to be complex with them often having a lot of fun together.
Similarly, Origins sees Chloe showing her father genuine affection after she's saved from Stoneheart:
[Image description: Chloe and Andre hugging and looking very happy to be together]
Origins is the baseline episode that tells us who the characters are on day one, so I never once doubted that Chloe loved Andre, but Andre didn't get akumatized because of Chloe's actions in season one. He didn't even get akumatized for something that Chloe had nothing to do with! His first akumatization is in season two, so it's not shocking that we don't get a Malidiktaor type scene until Malidiktaor.
Chloe was vulnerable with her personal hero when her beloved parent was in danger, but not before? Shocking! Who would have guessed?
Me. I would have guessed. I didn't even realize that people were reading it as some sort of character growth because it clearly wasn't. Malidiktaor didn't feel like something new for Chloe's character. It just felt like the writers were leaning into things that we'd always known about Chloe and using them to better establish her character as someone who genuinely cares about select people. She just doesn't show most of the time.
The same thing goes for Chloe's sacrifice and apology in Zombizou. Chloe only sacrifices herself when there's no one left but her and Ladybug. When the choice is to let the terrorist win or take the hit and let you personal hero save the day. Brave? Sure, but also not growth. Chloe is team Ladybug for all of seasons one, two, and three! She wants Ladybug to like her! Plus even a petty brat can have moments of goodness where they pick a hero over a literal terrorist.
This honestly would have been a damming moment if Chloe didn't sacrifice herself. She functionally had no other choice here. The entire episode builds itself to the self-sacrifice moment so that Chloe is forced to make that choice even though she's been her petty bratty self throughout the whole attack. It's genuinely solid writing.
Then, in the heightened emotions directly after the Zombizou win, we get this:
Miss Bustier: But I hurt a lot of people... Chloé: No... I did... I forgot your birthday, once again. And when I saw everyone had prepared a gift for you, I totally lost it. Because I, too, would've liked to offer you something. I'm sorry, Miss Bustier. Miss Bustier: Thank you, Chloé. Those words are the best possible gift you could ever give me. (hugs Chloé) (Chloé hugs her back, forgetting herself for a moment.) Chloé: Huh?... Uh, yeah. Okay then, we're all good.
A brief moment of vulnerability that quickly ends and does not stick around because Chloe's change was situational, not true growth. The next scene of that episode starts with Chloe being her usual self:
Chloé: Me? You want me to apologize to the entire class? Ridiculous! They should be thanking me for saving everybody.
And ends with the reveal of Chloe's gift to Miss Bustier, which was given in private via a note.
Once again, nothing new for Chloe's character. She acts as she always has, being mean to everyone while having moments of vulnerability when things get tense. Remember that hug between her and her father that we talked about earlier? Same concept. She had just almost died from an akuma attack and so she needed some emotional support, leading her to act more openly loving than she usually does when he's around. Once the moment is over, she reverts to the petty mean girl default.
Giving gifts to placate people is also something that we've seen before. A pretty similar thing happens at the end of Evil Illustrator, it's just played less sympathetic towards Chloe because the writers weren't giving her depth back then:
Sabrina: Too late. Chloé and I are doing the project together. Marinette: You mean, you're doing the project? Sabrina: Well, of course! After all she's been through... Marinette: Ughhh.... Nice new beret, by the way. Sabrina: I know, right! Chloé lent it to me. She really is my BFF! Chloé! Your geography homework's ready!
For any of this to be character growth, we need to see Chloe act differently over time. For her to be put in similar situations and get different outcomes, but we don't see that in part because Chloe didn't change and in part because season one didn't do much to develop Chloe's deeper side. We rarely see her alone or in moments of extreme vulnerability, but you need those moments to show her depth. That's why Despair Bear had Chloe crying alone after Adrien threatened to end her friendship and not before. Chloe is very reluctant to openly show depth. You have to force it out of her, which perfectly fits the character we met in season one.
Even her standing up to Hawkmoth and rejecting the akuma isn't character growth in my opinion. Chloe has always stood up to authority and demanded whatever she wants. She has wanted to be Ladybug's friend and be seen as a hero since season one, so it's not shocking that her extremely strong will would allow her to defy a terrorist. If there is anyone in this show who can stand up to a terrorist on shear "no!" power alone, it's little miss I-always-get-what-I-want. I could see a variation of this happening at any point in the show, just change Chloe's reason for defying Gabriel to match the situation. Rework these lines to be about a party that she wanted to go to and I'd still totally buy it:
Chloé: No, Hawk Moth! I am a superheroine! I am Queen Bee! Ladybug will come and get me when she needs me! I WILL NEVER JOIN YOU! (throws her photo onto the ground as the akuma exits it... and pants)
Chloe acted like a hero here because she wants all the perks of being a hero and can't believe that Ladybug would actually bench her. That's impossible! Ladybug wouldn't do that!
As soon as Chloe accepts that she won't be a hero again, Chloe stops acting heroic because acting heroic wasn't growth. It was her playing a part the same way she played a part in Despair Bear. She was doing what she needed to do to be Queen Bee again and not because it's the right thing to do. This would only be real growth if she rejected the akuma after accepting that she wouldn't be Queen Bee again, but that's not what happens. As soon as she accepts that she's out, she no longer has any reason to play nice. She never grew into a character who did what's right for the sake of doing the right thing. It's always been about getting what she wants or being seen how she wants to be seen. Until that changes, she hasn't changed.
So no, Chloe didn't have an aborted arc. They didn't start to redeem her and then change their minds. All they did was make Chloe one of the most complex characters in the show only to then not do anything with the character they wasted our time establishing, ignoring the complexity they gave her while also cranking her mean dial up to the point of absurdity where she's not even fun in her original role anymore.
I get why it feels like she had an aborted arc. The fact that the character establishment was delayed makes it feel like something shiny and new about Chloe. There's also the fact that the character establishment we get in season two is the kind of character establishment that you'd do if you were setting up for a redemption arc, but that doesn't change the fact that it was all establishment work. None of it was a true arc where we watched Chloe grow. We just saw her put in situations that revealed hidden depths.
Her showing depth is not her growing because when in the world does she show off this supposed growth? She only acts differently in the type of scenes that we've never seen her in before or around characters that we've never seen her truly interact with before. When she's around the established teen characters or in her usual scenes, then she acts the same way that she always has. We never see her be genuinely nice to Marinette or something like that. She's only nice to Ladybug and she's still rude to Chat Noir. That's not character growth! That's character establishment that can then be used to guide character growth!
Same thing goes for the stuff in Despair Bear. We learn that Adrien can push Chloe to be better, but he never does it again and she reverts as soon as he lets her off the hook, so it wasn't character growth! It was just Chloe establishing that she can play nice when she needs to. This means that she could grow if the story chose to take her down that path because we've established that she knows what being nice looks like. Fake it til you make it plot go, go, go! But the plot never went, went, went so meh?
Add in the fact that season one was a bit of a test season with lots of elements that got dropped and the fact that characterization in this show has always been wildly inconsistent from episode to episode and I'm really not seeing a strong argument for Chloe having an intentional arc that somehow got aborted. People just saw the potential for her to have one and argue that potential is the same as an aborted arc when it really, really isn't.
To give an analogy, Chloe's story is like walking into the kitchen and seeing grandma laying out the ingredients for her famous chocolate chip cookies. We get excited because, hey, cookies! Then we come back an hour later and there are no cookies. Nor is there some other sweet that uses the same ingredients. There's just ingredients, sitting unused in their original packaging, making us wonder what the heck grandma was up to. At the same time, she never really started making cookies. She just set out ingredients. They're still there, totally unused, waiting to be made into something, so we can't call them a failed cookie attempt. That implies a level of commitment that was never there. She didn't even say that she was making cookies! We just assumed she was because we, understandably, wanted cookies and wanted to believe that grandma had a purpose to her actions.
#ml writing critical#ml writing salt#chloe deserves better#I did initially think that they were going to redeem Chloe#But they only ever did the initial setup work#They never committed to anything#In fact I though Queen Bee's intro was the writers saying that she wouldn't be redeemed#And that the hero Chloe thing was just a fakeout to make people watch season two#Which is still what I think Queen Bee was#The writers love cheap fakeouts like ending a season on a mass reveal that then goes nowhere#Chloe's writing is par for the course and not anything especially bad compared to the rest of the show#Queen Bee was just an excuse to make you keep watching#Chloe was never getting redeemed or even properly damned#Is that deeply frustrating? Yes#But it's also the most logical read of her story with strong backing in the text itself#I'm not a fan of the conspiracy theories about the writers sabotaging her on purpose#That's just not how this goes#Sorry to disappoint but occam's razor applies to writing too#Bad writing is just infinitely more logical than a bunch of writers purposefully risking their careers to get back at online randos#Chloe stans are just not that important or influential#I can point to so many shows where people came up with insane theories to justify the bad writing and it's just...#I get the desire for complex reasons to explain why a thing you loved failed you but that's just not a logical conclusion in most situation#Nor is it all that healthy to go down those conspiracy rabbit holes. That's just going to damage your mental health#Curious to see the reaction to this one#Remember we're talking about fiction here and play nice please
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Cultural Differences: A Shadowgast Rec List
This week, we have cultural differences! Check under the cut for 10 fics that explore the differences in Caleb and Essek's cultures and how it affects their relationship, and don't forget to comment and kudos if you like them!
Courting of the Caleb by VexedVixen (6884, Mature) Reccer's Content Notes: No Content Notes, Choose Not to Warn
Beau realizes Essek is courting Caleb before Caleb does.
Reccer says: Good world building, itâs cute, and plenty of both Caleb and Essek being flustered!
The Secret Romance of Essek Thelyss by Cardinal_Daughter (18629, Explicit) Reccer's Content Notes: No Content Notes
All Essek wants is to celebrate his and Caleb's anniversary and present him with a very special gift. Naturally, nothing goes quite as planned.
Reccer says: I liked it!
Double Dip by Defiler_Wyrm (622, Mature) Reccer's Content Notes: No Content Notes
Calebâs Empire table manners threaten to ruin a perfectly pleasant dinner. (Heâs going to get away with it, the little shit.)
Reccer says: Just a saucy little slice of life, pun intended.
Fine Things by Defiler_Wyrm (1296, General) Reccer's Content Notes: No Content Notes
Essek is accustomed to luxury on a scale that Caleb finds baffling and troublesome. Sometimes, though, he has a point.
Reccer says: This is a fic about culture clash in terms of class, and about poverty trauma, handled gently. I tend to think that the class disparity between Caleb and Essek must be a touchier thing to navigate than the broader Empire vs. Dynasty ones, and that's exactly what this fic is about.
Love Letters to be Tossed in the Fire by Anonymous (61367, Teen) Reccer's Content Notes: No Content Notes
Caleb and Essek get to know each other through a series of letters
Reccer says: This fic is creatively and beautifully written. I love the different ways the letters are sent. The two wizards learn about each other and their different cultures through the course of this fic, especially at the end.
Loose Translation by owlaholic68 (58379, Teen) Reccer's Content Notes: No Content Notes
Due to an incredible comedy of errors on the part of the Cerberus Assembly, what is thought to be a pesky bureaucratic for one meddlesome Caleb Widogast, turns out to be a powerful political alliance and symbol of peace and unity between the Dynasty and Empire⊠through the marriage of Shadowhand Essek Thelyss and Caleb Widogast. Canon compliant until episode 141.
Reccer says: This is one of my all time favorite fics! The author does an incredible job at writing the political intrigue, manages a beautiful balance of the fluffiest fluff you could ever imagine with an undercurrent of yearning and angsty misunderstanding, all the while exploring the worldbuilding of the Kryn Dynasty in a way that is soso tasty. Truly, this is an addicting read that had me screaming, kicking my feet, and hyping up the characters to âgo get his ass!!â all throughout.
Love in Creation by LuckyOwlsFoot (1662, General) Reccer's Content Notes: No Content Notes
Caleb watches Essek work, and learns a little about the role of lace making to the Kryn dens.
Reccer says: The author does a great job at describing the physical motions of tatting, I felt like I could see it and understand what was happening despite have very little understanding of the craft- this really added to the visuals of the fic.
The following three fics each received two recs!
of blossoming hearts and glittering souls by quinn_of_aebradore (77995, Teen) Reccer's Content Notes: No Content Notes
Caleb and Essek realize they've caught the Feelings, and try to figure out how to propose to each other, with each other's different cultural customs
Reccer 1 says: It's so soft and sweet, it's a lovely read <3 Reccer 2 says: This fic is so sweet. It's so sweet. It pulls no punches when it comes to expressing emotion and revolves around the entire proposal, engagement, and marriage/lovebinding procedures with such depth and care. Read it and weep (the happiest of tears)!
but i didnât do it right, can i try again, and again? by queenbeetle (53385, Explicit) Reccer's Content Notes: No Content Notes
An already together Caleb and Essek play at Dynasty courting rituals, but they keep their hands off each other long enough to play the game?
Reccer 1 says: Iâm gonna be so straight forward this fic is SUPER hot. There is a phenomenal scene with gloves, and I will say nothing more. I really enjoy the cultural differences as seen through courting thing, especially when theres some misunderstandings about the levels of intimacy something might imply sprinkled in- and this definitely has that! Reccer 2 says: It has a delightful build up with a very rewarding and steamy pay off!
Indecency by RainyDayDecaf (5898, Teen) Reccer's Content Notes: Graphic Depictions of Violence, The fic is tagged with graphic depictions of violence, the scene written is about canon typical levels of violence
The many times Essek and Caleb accidentally court one another by Kryn or Blumenthal traditions and when they finally do it on purpose!
Reccer 1 says: Not only is it very cute, the world building is also very smart. The Blumenthal traditions that are made up by the author feel very in the spirit of what would be considered romantic to the way Caleb grew up. They clearly took time to flesh out his background and folk traditions just as much as they do Essekâs high class courting etiquette, which is a true treat! Reccer 2 says: It's wonderfully written and descriptive! Also just very funny and sweet with lots of good pining.
Want more fics that explore cultural differerences? Check out our previous rec list on this subject!
This is one of our weekly communally-generated shadowgast rec lists. Every week we announce a new theme and allow anyone to submit a fic recommendation.Â
And hey, anyone includes you!
Next week, we'll be featuring getting nerdy about magic! Any fics coming to mind? Well, then use this form to submit!
#shadowgast#caleb widogast#essek thelyss#critical role#cr fic recs#fan fiction rec list#critical role fan fiction#cr fic#cr fics
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