#Free cass from being a literal cardboard cutout

[snottertooder]

An Angel loses its wings everytime Jason is the angry Robin

An angel dies everytime someone doesn’t draw Damian brown

An angel dies in agony everytime Duke gets excluded out of the batfamily

An angel cries for help while being tortured every second of its life every time people make Cass mute (aka a pokemon 😐)

[dalekofchaos]

My problem with DCEU’s Birds Of Prey

I was excited that we are gonna see Black Canary, Huntress and Montoya as the Question and possibly Barbara as Oracle and Cassandra Cain’s live action debut. But then I read the rumored synopsis.

"After splitting up with The Joker, Harley Quinn and three other female superheroes – Black Canary, Huntress and Renee Montoya – come together to save the life of a little girl (Cassandra Cain) from an evil crime lord."

Okay if this rumor is true. I honestly have no interest in this movie. 

It is rumored that Black Mask will be the villain of the movie and are you serious? Do you honestly expect me to believe that Black Mask can subdue and hold Cassandra Cain hostage? It would be ONE THING if this were Lady Shiva or David Cain. But Black Mask? Cassandra Cain would absolutely DESTROY Roman Sionis. The mere thought that Cass needs saving from Sionis is preposterous and idiotic. This is how you’re gonna introduce Cassandra Cain, the best Batgirl, Bruce’s daughter and one of the best combatants in the DCU? What the actual fuck are you even doing?

Now to my issue with Harley.

“Harley joins The Birds Of Prey” Let me stop you right there. It is already canon in the DCEU that Harley Quinn helped The Joker murder Jason Todd. Do you honestly think Barbara and Helena would ever accept Harley’s help? Do you honestly think there is a force alive that could stop Helena Bertinelli from killing Harley Quinn for what she and Joker did to Jason? And if DC chose to keep Zack Snyder’s bullshit of Dick being the Robin who died, do you fucking really expect me to believe Barbara to ever accept Harley Quinn’s help if Dick was the Robin who died? The mere concept that Barbara and Helena would ever accept Harley’s help after what Joker and Harley did to Jason is complete and utter bullshit. Harley has already shown in Suicide Squad that she’s a villain. “We’re bad guys, it’s what we do” Harley and Joker are in love in these movies. Harley willingly went home with The Joker, showing that she loves him. Whether Margot Robbie, WB/DC likes it or not The Joker and Harley love each other.

And now I need to address the real problem I have with how DC treats Harley. 

Harley Quinn is a villain. 

Harleen Quinzel chose to become Harley Quinn.  Harleen Quinzel was not tortured or thrown in chemicals to become Harley Quinn. Harleen Quinzel fell in love with The Joker in therapy. There is a large portion of manipulation on The Joker’s part, but it was Harleen’s choice to become Harley Quinn. She’s not a victim of The Joker’s madness, she chose to become who she is.

Their relationship isn’t one sided abuse it’s an on and off again relationship. The Joker and Harley are both insane and dysfunctional, there is no way this can be a normal and healthy relationship because that is the complete opposite of these two characters. No one is saying the relationship is healthy nor do I suggest it to be healthy or a relationship to strive towards. It’s meant to be a violent, unstable relationship. It’s also fictional. It’s a fictional relationship between two horrible, demented murdering clowns. To pretend the relationship is a run of the mill one that’s portrayed as healthy is just preposterous. Same with pretending the relationship isn’t also filled with a sick, twisted romance. Romanticizing Joker/Harley isn’t the problem. The problem is encouraging the behaviors, which no one is. And I love them together, they are like the psychotic clownish super villain Bonnie And Clyde. The Joker DOES love Harley, he is incapable of showing it normally because he has never felt love for anyone and because he’s trash. If he didn’t love Harley he would have killed her ages ago, if all he needed was a way out of Arkham, Harley would have been killed.  He tries to kill her to push her away because he thinks that romance is a distraction and alien. Really, Joker sees Harley as the perfect partner. and this is according to Harley’s creator Paul Dini, The Joker himself Mark Hamil and Harley herself Arleen Sorkin “He loves her as much as he can. He loves her in his way.” -Paul Dini “…That, to me, is kinda their private life. Joker opens up and in those moments he is whatever he is at his core and all his demons come in. And the only one he trusts with that is Harley, or Harley’s the only one who knows how to deal with him in those moments.” -Paul Dini “Expressing emotion in any way that’s real and meaningful is alien to The Joker, but he’s learning those parts of himself, however unconsciously, through Harley.” -Mark Hamil “Everyone else sees The Joker laugh; only Harley has ever seen him cry.” -Arleen Sorkin She’s completely and utterly obsessed and in love with The Joker. She loves Ivy too, but her heart is primarily with Joker. Hell there was a comic where Joker was all nice and sweet to Harley and eventually Harley became bored and tried to get the old Joker back. Harley is in love with the mad clown, Harley wouldn’t have it any other way.

Harley Quinn is not a hero nor is she a anti-hero as DC has been trying to reshape her as. Harley Quinn IS A VILLAIN! Harley is not this role-model, she is a psychopath and a villain. Harley is not as psychotic as The Joker, Harley Quinn can be just as dangerous. Harley isn’t this precious baby, she isn’t a precious teddy bear and she isn’t someone to coddle regardless of how much you love her.  She doesn’t need to be protected from The Joker when she’s a super villain who has murdered her fair share of people and can hold her own against The Joker. She’s also crazy exuberant and peppy. She’s lighthearted evil.

Harley Quinn isn’t a pushover or defenseless cinnamon roll “that must be protected at all costs”. Harley can defend herself and kick Joker’s ass, she can hold her own against Batman(Harley came the closest to killing Batman) or any of the rouge’s gallery and she can fought Mercy Graves and she won that fight!

Harley works best as a second in command/follower. Why?  Because she became a villain in the first place to follow someone. And she as a villain only follows two people, Joker and Ivy. She has no motivation if she’s not following someone else, and her character is not meant to be heroic or quirky. She’s obsessive, lovesick and is solely devoted to her two loves. She kills for Joker and Ivy, she steals for them, she collaborated with them. If she’s not with one of them, her heart isn’t in it. And having her own solo series had rendered her into just another generic female anti hero. And since she was created to be a sidekick, she really works best in small doses. Trying to overwrite her character weakens the complexities of her.

Harleen Quinzel did not come to Arkham Asylum to help people. Harleen was power hungry and saw the inmates as a get rich quick scheme for a book and wanted to be the one to understand The Joker’s secrets and what made him what he is. In her own words. “I’ve always had an attraction for extreme personalities, they’re more exciting more challenging. You can’t deny there’s an element of glamour to these super criminals.”

Harley’s dad was and is a con artist. He’s been in and out of jail, constantly cheating on Harley’s mom, duping rich women for everything they have. Growing up in Bensonhurst around her constantly cheating and lying father, being left in squalor with her bitter mom and slacker brother, Harley vowed she’d be different, make a difference and actually be somebody. But it’s the classic tale of growing up to be what you hate. Harley loved cutting corners like her dad, though I imagine she always justified that to herself by saying she was actually going to make a difference, unlike her con artist father. And then she also became her mother, by falling in with The Joker, who is scarily a lot like her father.  

Harleen Quinzel  was already traumatized and unstable from her fiance committing suicide right front of her but went into Arkham right after that anyways because she wanted to study the inmates from Arkham Asylum and wanted to study The Joker so she could be famous for  learning his secrets, which we all know what happened. I would say the madness was already in Harley just buried underneath, The Joker just helped it surface.

Like it or not The Joker and Harley are made for each other. Harley’s entire character is built around The Joker. The only way Harley would ever be free from Joker’s influence is if she stripped away the clown aesthetic, stopped calling herself Harley Quinn and became Harleen Quinzel again.  Harley is supposed to be obsessed with the Joker and no one else, she was created for The Joker.  In my opinion, taking away the obsession a character is literally built around will not improve it.  Everything would have been different if Harley hadn’t been built around the Joker, but she was created for him, therefore taking her away from him not only is out of character, but is also bad for the character itself. Joker, like it or not, was and still is what made Harley a special, complex character. Harley Quinn does not work without The Joker and does not work by trying to make her a hero or an anti-hero. She was created to be a villain and taking that away does not work at all

The issue with Harlivy. I love Harley and Ivy together  but I hate what The New 52 and Rebirth and  Jimmy Palmiotti & Amanda Conner have turned them into. This has to do largely because Poison Ivy is no longer Poison Ivy. In the New 52, Poison Ivy is no longer an eco-terrorist/feminist, she no longer hates humans, she has no character and is just a cardboard cutout who is Harley’s love interest. And if you hate Joker/Harley because it’s an abusive relationship that’s fine and dandy but do not act like Harley/Ivy are the perfect girlfriends. Both relationships are not good for Harley. Ivy is abusive and manipulative of Harley. Ivy has beaten Harley, guilt-trips and manipulates Harley to abandon Joker for her, and further toys with her mind, restricts her daily life, and threatens her if she ever shows any interest to leave Ivy to go back to Joker. Ivy has poisoned her, left her for dead, had fantasies about strangling her, and all because Harley annoyed Ivy and either messed up their plans or put her plants in danger. Ivy is not the perfect girlfriend for Harley that the fans choose to picture, Ivy is a super villain who has no regard for human life, Harley is the only exception, but even sometimes Ivy wants to kill Harley and has tried many times to do so. She is not the character The New 52 and Rebirth keeps telling you she is. I love Harley/Ivy but the New 52 and it’s fans have pretty much driven me away, I love them in DCAU and in the pre-DCU but I do not ignore the abuse.

I don’t think some fans love Harley. They are in love with the idea of who they think Harley Quinn is and they reject the previous universe/classic version of Harley. Fans are willing to accept the New 52 version over classic. In the New 52 Harley is no longer the villain we love. She’s a looney toon female deadpool. I love that they made Harley/Ivy a thing but the writers do not understand either character AT ALL. It’s sad really. A character who is so well written in the past but instead the majority of her fandom prefers a watered down version that is not her, but a generic Deadpool clone and prefer to have Ivy be totally out of character just so Harley and her can be in a relationship.